RDWC Soon....

[JungleChild]

What's Up GWE !!!!!!!

I just want to shout out to Nebz Haze, 4 Side, & all others on this site for activating my account
ALONG with providing a loving community that provides a vast amount of platinum information
for new cultivators like myself to learn from and a lot more that benefits us all!

Soon I am going to invest within a ideal RDWC DIY Setup
annnd I want to get a few questions answered and a few opinions
on what I'll need to get certain results and succeed on my first grow

Note: I am NOT as new as a person who's never ever grown before, I have small experiences here and there
with the help of this site and the blog the GWE Team has put together for us all...

Ok So Here's The IDEAL Set Up And Goals I WISH Manifest Into The Near Future...

DRAFT SKETCH 1: I Forgot To Add The Return Line & Split From Plant 2 to The Reservoir...


DRAFT SKETCH 2: THE SPLIT AND RETURN PIPES / PVCs


CHECKLIST: First Draft

• 4 x 8 (96x48x80) or 8 x 8 (96x96x80) grow tent - Space
• 2 1000 w hps lights + 2 1000 w mhs (cool tubes + xl hoods) - Lights
• 3 17 gallon rope tubs (more root more fruit) - Root Space Pots
• 1 20-32 qt storage bin with latches or 7-13 gallon garbage bin (open & close lid) - Reservoir
• 5 inch net pots - Pots
• 2 400 gph water pumps ???? - Water Pump
• 4x2 air stones (4 each pot container) - Air Stones
• 3 4 outlet (pots) & 1 2 outlet air pumps ???? - Air Pumps
• PVCs & flow tubes for manifold and water transfer??? - Water Transfer
• 2 24 hour timer - Timer
• rise tubes - Water Indicators
• a/c cooling system?? - Chiller
• heater ?? - Heater
• 2 scrog nets - SOG
• nutes - Nutrients
• carbon filter & fan combo - Exhaust & Ventilation
• ???? - Odor Controller
• ducting - Fan, Light, Connections
• ph meter - PH Meter
• c02 meter - C02 Meter
• humidifier meter - Humidifier Meter
• temp meter - Temperature Meter
• To Be Continued......

and muchhhh more because I don't know EVERYTHING needed at this moment... but I will
BTW. this list will be constantly updated in posts to keep everyone updated & up to par for anyone else that wants to start a similar system

AND also to help me keep track of what's needed to make updates before buying and making this operation a true working machine


Now a few goals of interest on my first grow...

• Minimum of 2 & Half Pounds Yield
• Mid Pricing Budget - $600-1300

I understand that I have to make the right cuts, hole holders, measurements of pvc, proper heights of buckets and rezzy etc...

I honestly need to get the supplies checklist right FIRST, then I will begin to ask more questions about the SUPER technical details for this setup


BTW I'm using techniques and knowledge of liquidjade, hygrohybird & the GWE info to string most of this together...


You Guys Think It's Possible??? I think it will be able to be effective and even more

[Toker1]

Nutrients, rope hangers (for adjusting light height), fan speed controllers, plant stakes (something for training like tomato cages, plant ties, trellis), plant yo yo’s (for buds that slump over).

[Toker1]

I like to enhance my HPS with UV t5 side lighting to increase resin production (but not 100% necessary, highly recommended).

[JungleChild]

Toker1 do you also run rdwc or dwc?

and also does a certain nutrient combo guarantee great health and massive yields I should know about?

[Toker1]

Yes, I do soil in summer and DWC in winter. I use fox farm, but no... it’s not a nutrient that does that. To yield high, you have to dial in your set up. And overcome your limiting factors.

https://www.growweedeasy.com/yields-limiting-factor

[JungleChild]

Toker1 okay cool, so I basically have everything everything as in supplies + additions from your comments for this set up ??

I do want to ask, what can I do about getting air inside the tent if I don’t have the luxury of using a window?

[Toker1]

Well, depends...I saw ac? And ventilation. So you will need to decide on if you are sealing the room and going with AC (in that case you will also need co2 enrichment).
If you don’t have any windows, I assume you are working inside a sealed room, in that case you will need to use the AC for cooling and you need a co2 system to replace the air plants breathe.

[HappyDaze]

With 4000W of HID lighting, you're going to have some serious ducting and ventilation controls to build...that's enough heat to keep a small apartment warm in the middle of a Canadian winter.

I think you might consider much, much larger reservoirs if you're serious about using that much lighting. Under my single 1000W, the plants will drink 2 + gallons a day at peak veg. Mixing and replenishing nutrients in a large grow is going to be time consuming, you might need an auto doser and a control system to keep them all fed.

I've always been happy with DWC and don't see the advantage of recycling and drip feeding buckets. The pumps add heat and manifolding all your buckets together makes them hard to move around. I grow in large containers...one 55 liter and two 80 liter totes. The large volume mitigates swings in pH, solution concentration and temps in the root zone.

I'm currently using GH Maxi series dry nutrients on my DWC plants, with about half the supplemental that GH recommends. They're very inexpensive compared to connoisseur nutrients like AN and others. I don't see any advantage using the high priced additives. When I do use extras, it's just humic and fulvic acid.

[JungleChild]

HappyDaze Is it though?? my actual intentions were to use 2 1000w mhs during veg then take them out and replace them with gloves with the 2 1000w hps for flower

And I'm glad you actually said something about the ducting and ventilation systems, is it possible if I could use a 6 inch fan + 6 carbon scrubber these two lights ??
or would I need another hood & light cooling combo to successfully keep the heat and circulations maintained??

[HappyDaze]

Depends on the fan and the carbon can, you really want to look at the CFM ratings...I've got an old 4" Grotek fan that I think is rated for 215 CFM and it just makes it to cool my 1000W in a 6.5 x 6.5 ft x 8ft room. Rule of thumb is to exhaust the entire room volume every five minutes or so.

When you're comparing carbon canisters, ask about the actual volume of activated carbon in the can....you're paying for the activated carbon, not the sheet metal around it, and cheaper cans won't have as much in them.

[JungleChild]

HappyDaze AND I have that noted about the nutrients and space. I picked the large rope tubs because they're pretty big ! and I did have a thought about DWC yesterday,
I just figured I wouldn't have to change out water as much on every bucket or tub if it's circulating within the system back to the rezzy
then I can just put certain valves on the return line, turn it off, and switch out the water on the rezzy and clean it

BUT with heat being created with the pumps I've got a slightly different perspective because I need to maintain temps and humidity

[Toker1]

You don’t need to submerge the pumps. Adds way less heat when you operate them inline instead of submerged.
Another advantage to recirc is you can add shut off valves to isolate buckets. If one plant get a disease in a larger DWC system, where all plants share the same water that can be devastating. So no isolation capabilities. Recirc is the only way to go when you are pushing 100 buckets. For this application, single totes will work just as well. Just a bit more testing and filling to do.

[HappyDaze]

Toker1 makes a good point. Anytime I've done a "big" grow I filled my room with 3 clones each in the 80 liter tubs with a long veg. If you're production growing, it'll be a ;lot more smaller plants with a faster turn over.

[JungleChild]

HappyDaze so I would need some type of chiller connected to the rezzy?? orrr I could use 2 frozen 2 liters full of water to keep it cool lol ???

[Toker1]

You need a chiller. Changing water bottles out like that is a pain and inefficient. The day you forget to change one out and you have root rot, you will wish you had gotten that chiller.

[HappyDaze]

I second that...4000W is something like 15,000 BTU of cooling requirements for air only. Commercial chillers are pricey. If cost is a consideration, I've seen some decent home built units using a bar fridge and pail full of coiled tubing submerged in E.G., but then you have to phuk around with a control setup to make it work right.

[JungleChild]

Toker1 I did notice HH didn't have his pumps in the water, instead he ran them sitting on a small counter with the tubes running inline to the rez and buckets

[Toker1]

Exactly. Inline pumps for recirc. It’s the way to go.

[JungleChild]

Toker1 chillers expensive or what ??? are there other alternatives to chilling water ???

[Toker1]

Chillers are expensive to purchase. But more efficient than AC is to run. Besides making the room itself cool enough to chill the water, only other option is not to grow hydro.
That’s why I do soil in the summer times.

[JungleChild]

You need a chiller. Changing water bottles out like that is a pain and inefficient. The day you forget to change one out and you have root rot, you will wish you had gotten that chiller.

so would you suggest I change the wattage on the lights ??? if expensive cooling is the cost??

I still want to hit the minimum yield of 2.5 pounds though... Maybe 3 600 w hps lights along with the mhs for veg ??

[Toker1]

If everything is dialed in, you can yield 3-4 lbs per 1000w HPS. I suggest double ended bulbs in this case.
I started out with a 400w light. I didn’t yield pounds, but it also didn’t cost hundreds per month to run. I had many failures at first. Learning curve. Good thing I only lost a few ozs instead of a few pounds during that learning time.
My suggestion is start smaller. Get good at growing. Once you are at the point where your meds are consistently at the quality you want them to be...then try for the weight you want.
Better to screw up smaller than larger imo.

[HappyDaze]

Thumbs up to everything Toker1 suggested. And when he talked about running costs per month, I wonder if your space has the power available? Even if you run 240V everywhere, you're going to be pulling 40-50 Amps, maybe more?

If 2.5 Lbs is the goal, you can do it with less than half of the 4000W you were considering. I'm a hack at growing and I consistently get a pound from my 1000W. For the space I have available, I'm under lit. I'd guess that I could double my weight with two 600s run side by side, and without changing my setup substantially.

[JungleChild]

HappyDaze Toker1 everything can be powered and the environment will be perfect, just need to HACK the pound method per light like you said...
and I do 100% understand the training of the plants to make the light efficient etc

I;m just a little lost at ONE 1000w double ended hps light and how I can yield the goal amount

meaning... in a 4x8 (96 x 48 x 80) big tent environment with THREE plants, big totes/tubs for roots of each plant, ONE double ended of a 1000w can get my desired 2.5 pound yield????

do you think that one light will cover that entire space efficiently ????


also the two 600 side can double that weight??? that's 1200w in total compared to 2000w ??? send me knowledge please lol

[Toker1]

One 1000w light with DE bulb will cover a 5x5 space nicely. Yes, you can get that off 1plant if you veg and train long and well enough. You can always buy the book three per light by Joshua Haupt for a full in-depth tutorial on how to accomplish 3 lbs per 1000w light. It’s mostly strain dependent. Like I said before, it’s about discovering your limiting factor and eliminating it. You will find your first limiting factor after growing your first batch. No one here can offer any crystal ball advice...you can either follow what someone else has already done (buy the book or find a tutorial). Or you can figure this out by trial and error. Grower skill level has more to do with yield than anything.

[HappyDaze]

When Toker1 says he can get 2.5 / 1000, using a good DE lamp, you have to remember....that guy is very good. I don't think he could or would try to light the whole 4 x 8 space, unless it was on a light rail, which is a good option BTW.

I say 2 x 600 to get 2 Lbs in my 6.5 x 6.5 space, with my limited skills and the genetics I'm growing. Here's why...

Using 2 x 600 vs 1 x 1000 to double yield is possible because you're able to effectively cover a substantially greater footprint, so the ratio isn't 1200/1000, it's greater. The distance / intensity ratio plays a huge factor because light intensity diminishes at the square of the distance from the bulb. Say you have a bulb 2 ft straight up from your buds and you're delivering 600 μmol/s to the center of the canopy. If you measure the light 2ft to one side of center, your bulb is actually closer to 3ft from the bulb and that 600 μmol/s drops down to just 300 μmol/s. If you overlap the beams on the 600s properly, you can effectively cover pretty close to 50% more area than you are able to light with one conventional 1000W HID. You know yourself, those colas in the center are where the weight's at. Easy to see how adding to that perfect light zone can 2x your weight.

[Toker1]

It took me many years of yielding next to nothing to discover what not to do. Cost a lot of electricity and many moldy jars to get to where I am at over 20 years after my first grow.

[JungleChild]

Toker1 understood! I guess the real question I'm asking here is which would be the best / MOST light coverage + wattage combo for a 4x8 rdwc style grow tent AND be most efficient ??????

HappyDaze said I can accomplish a 2.5 pound yield in a 4x8 tent with half of 4000w that I had chosen...

so that's where I'm at RIGHT NOW

[Toker1]

Depends, are you running co2 or not? Co2 requires heavier light saturation to be efficient.
If not, you can use 2 each 600w lights and yield your goal assuming you can accomplish 1 gram per watt with your skill level.
1000w light could be inefficient in a 4x4 if the light hits the side walls. So that depends on your reflector.
So many factors that determine yield. Not all feet fit one shoe if you know what I mean.

[Toker1]

Here is the book I was talking about. He says if you follow his methods to the “T”. You can yield 3lbs per 1000w light.

https://threealight.com/