Undecided About Microscopic Bugs

[coldjack]

Hello there,

I'm new on this forum but not new to cannabis forums

The two little bugs in the video are just a tiny sample of the same type of bug roaming around on the underside of the fan leaves.

https://imgur.com/a/uBAGOpf

I'm almost convinced that the bugs are not beneficial and cause the lower plant leaves to brown and die off.

My guess is the parent bugs themselves don't eat the leaves but die after laying their eggs (white dots in the video) on the leaves which then hatch and the baby bugs immediately start to eat the green leaf until the leaves brown and die off.

I know there are many reasons why leaves brown and die but the bugs on my plants seem to be the most likely cause.

Is there a slight chance the plants may have a fungal infection and the bugs eat the fungus?

Best regards,

A very Cold Jack

[crucialbunny]

Not sure what you're undecided about but to my eyes those are spider mites or what many here refer to as "the Borg."

[9fingerleafs]

Those are mites. Not sure what kind. Could be spider mites or broad mites. There are many different strategies to deal with them. The most effective low tech in my opinion is: first of all try to remove the most colonized leaves. Then fill a big spray bottle with half water and half rubbing alcohol. Twice a day turn off the light or place in shadow if outdoors and spray over and UNDER the leaves. Covering everything with the water alcohol mixture. Then let dry for half an hour or untill you see the leaves are dry. Then place back under light. Twice a day for a couple of weeks should do the trick.

If only some plants are affected then separate from the rest of the grow. You can look online for different types of mites and ready to use products for pest control. A few mites here and there are harmless but if they get out of control they'll get everywhere and it's going to be very hard to get rid off them

[crucialbunny]

9fingerleafs You've been MIA for a bit. Nice to see you and the knowledge you bring to to this forum again.

[9fingerleafs]

Thank you bunny. I've actually been lurking in the shadows and try to only respond when no one else does. But I have been really busy last couple of years. Growing it's my full time occupation and can be very time consuming doing all by myself.

I'm glad you and a few other members are still around sharing and keeping the forum alive

[AGH]

Those are mites and the sooner you eliminate (or reduce) them the better. They can go from just a few to a full-blown invasion in a matter of days.

There are several different ways to get rid of them but using a multi-pronged approach (officially called integrated pest management if you're going to do any google searching) is going to be best.

A few things to remember:

- NO MATTER WHAT, EVEN WHEN YOU THINK THEY'RE GONE, KEEP ON USING YOUR MULTI-PRONGED APPROACH FOR AT LEAST 3 WEEKS OR MORE AFTER YOU STOP SEEING THE PESTS! This is important because they can lay eggs on the undersides of leaves and in the soil that will hatch and repopulate if you let your guard down too soon. Depending on where you are in your grow, you may have to continue your eradication efforts until harvest.
- Your goal is going to be to cause population collapse and this takes 2-3 generations to complete. Bug generations, not people generations.
- I ran into a mite issue a few grows ago. I grow organically so I used insecticidal soap every couple of days, neem oil (do your research) every couple of days, and I made sure that the top of the soil was consistently dusted with diatomaceous earth. Alternating between neem and insecticidal soap tends to work better than just doing one or the other.
- When using the insecticidal soap and neem oil, spray the tops and undersides of the leaves as well as the top of the soil to get any eggs or bugs crawling there. Killing the eggs is very helpful in eradicating the population.
- Do NOT get soap or Neem oil on the buds if you're in the flowering stage. If you're in the flowering stage, skip the Neem oil completely.
- If you're not growing organic, there are more options to consider including BT, peroxide sprays/drenches, etc. These tend to be pretty effective at getting rid of pests but they also destroy the soil biome in organic grows that you don't have to worry about when using synthetic nutrients.
- Make sure that your environment is dialed in. If the environment is conducive for cannabis growth, that usually means that it's NOT conducive for pests. That goes for different bugs, molds, fungus, etc. Amazing how nature works! Temps, humidity, watering regime, and air circulation are the top 4 in order of importance for pest mitigation/control.
- As 9fingerleafs mentioned, physically removing leaves or plants that are heavily infested goes a long way. This reduces the population significantly and will help a lot in causing population collapse.
- To help make sure that future grows don't run into the same problem, think back on what a possible source could be. Did you use soil that had eggs in it? Maybe you used a clone that had eggs on it? Do you use your watering can to water houseplants that might be infested? Did you wear shoes into your tent/grow area that might have had pests or their eggs on them? Did you have a friend who grows in your tent who may have inadvertently introduced them to your grow? There are lots of possibilities and you may not know for sure, but being aware of the pest vectors will help for the future.

The good things:
- As long as you start now and are persistent in your multi-pronged approach and you keep at it even after you stop seeing pests, it's likely that you can recover and have a strong harvest.
- Pests happen to every grower eventually and it's easy to think that it's all your fault. What is important is that you learn from it and use that knowledge on subsequent grows!
- You're doing a good thing by reaching out and doing research so you should be proud of that too!

Keep us posted with how it goes!

[Franklin]

AGH you should consider submitting an article for the main GWE site, you have a naturally kind andv instructive style that really matches what nebula does

[AGH]

Thanks friend, I appreciate the compliment! I'd love to have a tenth of the knowledge and experience that Nebula and Sirius have! I am happy to contribute to the conversation and hope that something that I mention is helpful to someone!

[SoOrbudgal]

Simple solutions short answer keep it clean.

[AGH]

That's the perfect summary to my long post! :-D

[JeffInCanada]

coldjack We all feel your pain ...great video btw, the tiny white balls on the leaf are their eggs.

Good luck!

[SoOrbudgal]

So far i've never had a infestation, thankfully. Spray bottle with bleach solution after every harvest i wipe my tent inside. I even wipe the wood pieces of block down that i elevate my pots on. And i wipe my scissors with ISO .

[AGH]

Cleaning before and after grows is essential for sure! I do a round of bleach (about 2-3 tsp per gallon), then I wipe with just water. Then, because I never want to have to deal with pests again, I do a round of hydrogen peroxide (not diluted) and then a final wipe-down with just plain water. Makes sure that any pests, bacteria, fungus, mold, etc. is gone before anything can take hold. Cleanliness/sanitation is often something that is overlooked but is a very important piece of the process.

Thanks for the reminder (and glad you've never had an infestation!) SoOrbudgal! *knocks on wood* :-D

[Rwise]

I use ISO mixed with water, recommended is 1 part ISO to 8 parts water (I have went 50/50 with no issue). Spray them from the under side, then the top , the soil, pot, floor walls everything. This just like spinosad must be repeated every 3 days for at least 3 treatments, with the lights off. These are contact killers and will only kill the adults, the eggs will then hatch so you must treat them again and again. After 3 or 4 treatments stop and watch for the return.
Good Luck!

[coldjack]

My apologies.

Before asking questions, I should have introduced myself and explained my setup and growing conditions.

This post is about bugs/mites and things could get confusing if I add those details now but I will if anyone is interested.

Thank you for the replies I suspect you are correct and speak from bitter experience.

I don't buy or sell cannabis bud but I do buy the occasional seeds.

The image below shows ten regular plants which were started on 1 January 2023 under 16 1/2 hours on 7 1/2 off. They are my own strain and I know that anything less than 16 hours of light will trigger flowering.





On the 5th of February, I changed the lights to 14 on and 10 off to start the flowering transition to determine sex and which male plants to keep to progress my strain and which female plants to re-veg for cropping later in the year.

It was at this time I started to notice the bug/mite problem and decided to take action to kill them off but not quickly.

Last year I had the same problem with one of the strains I was crossing while the other strain was completely bug/mite free.

The same thing seems to be happening with new-strain seeds except now I can select only bug-resistant plants to continue the development of the new strain.

Happy Days!

Cold Jack

[homegrown]

Not sure if i understand this correctly.. If you only start from seeds, and haven't introduced any clones from elsewhere, your bug(mite) problem is coming from your system, weather it be grow medium, eggs in the tent, grow pots, lights..those critters can survive for a long time. do you have other plants in your house?

[coldjack]

Hello, homegrown,

The problem mites were probably carried in by the soil and compost mix I used when re-potting and the perfect growing conditions for seedlings also hatched the problem mite's eggs laying dormant in the soil.

Yesterday, I changed the lights to 12-12 for the last week of the transition to flowering and fully expect to be able to identify the sex of the plants in two weeks give or take. At that stage, I'll transfer the plants to my Polytunnels (hoop-house in the US?) where they will be exposed to far more insects, bugs and mites where indiscriminate use of insecticide can cause more problems than it solves.

Things are on track for a mid-spring seed harvest while I'll have some verified females vegging in my light dep tents for a planned early summer harvest.

I noticed your growing "White Widow photos X 5 3 gal pots TNSB" which is a coincidence because I crossed White Widow with Passion No 1 to get my new strain Widow Passion

Best regards

Cold Jack

[Bootsy]

Best of luck with the mites. I have had 2 infestations (realize now i brought them in from outside and avoid carefully) and ended up killing both batches due to bugs. First time I tried keeping them at bay with diatomaceous earth, the ISO spraying, insecticidal soaps for mites and they just keep coming back for me. I ended up giving up the first time after a lot of daily extra work, and second time just folded and cleansed tents for next grow as soon as I saw them. This experience is consistant with many others I consulted with. Hope it works out, but my advice would be to kill and sanitize and re-start. Those F....rs are nicknamed the borg for a reason. Please do update on your efforts if you have time. Cheers

[coldjack]

Hello Bootsy,

Thank you for replying and for your (free) advice on the most sensible way to proceed with indoor grow tents.

My seeming laissez-faire regarding the mite problem is not because I'm ignoring advice. I've spotted further opportunities to develop my strain by carefully selecting which bug-resistant plants to use in the seed grow. A happy accident, if you will.

I have sprayed my plants with Bug Clear Ultra to slow the infestation. I have also lowered the heating mat's temperature to acclimatise the plants before transferring them to the much cooler polytunnels and (self-built and designed) light-deprivation tents.

Please let me know if you or anyone else are interested in starting a thread about DIY light dep tents. I've got four proven examples that should provoke some interesting discussions.

Best regards to all Canadians and you Bootsy.

Jack

[coldjack]

Borg Babies

https://imgur.com/KyoKIJ8

I sprayed with Bug Clear Ultra on the 10th of February, making sure to soak both sides of the leaves, soil and tent walls.

Today, I removed any leaf with black speckled dots on the top or brown damage and checked the effectiveness of the first spraying under the microscope.

The spray seems to have slowed down the infestation. It did not kill them all. I hope the second spraying, due on the 20th of February, will be more effective.

The plants are starting to stretch and show the first signs of male flowers. By next weekend, I should be able to select which plants to keep for my seed grow.

Happy days!

[Rwise]

You'll have a new hatch every 4 or 5 days, they will lay more eggs to be hatched.

[coldjack]

In frame 30. Does the mite start to lay an egg or is it taking a dump? I need to get an Entomologist to give feedback.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJ-ckYUQJ5s

I stopped using Imgur for video uploads because they use too much compression.

Youtube is much better at showing the micro details.

No Adsense or other money-making devices.

[SoOrbudgal]

Yuck who gives a shit you see one you got hundreads. Ask google I hate them destructive bugs.

[coldjack]

Yep, that's for sure. I've been watching them for days and every time I start to itch.

[coldjack]

"We are the Borg. You will be assimilated. Resistance is futile." file info
– Borg Collective, 2373 ("Scorpion")
"In the words of Jean-Luc Picard. "In their Collective state, the Borg are utterly without mercy, driven by one will alone: the will to conquer. They are beyond redemption, beyond reason." And then there's Captain Amasov of the Endeavour. "It is my opinion that the Borg are as close to pure evil as any race we've ever encountered."
– Kathryn Janeway, 2373 ("Scorpion")

[Blowdout2269]

So, you're just hanging out with these critters now "watching them"?
I'd be getting rid of them and cleaning stuff up!

[coldjack]

Hey, I've hung out with worse critters. LOL

[Blowdout2269]

My palm ---> My forehead