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**Paracelsus** · 01-28-2018, 07:24 AM

Cocho I just want to be sure I understand your PH situation. Your Tap water is high around 8.5 and goes as low as 5.5 in a week or so after feeding/watering.

So you are saying when you feed and water your plant it normally swings up from below 6.0 to above 8.0 when you water and feed. To me that is a very wide swing. you asked about how to adjust pH up. Baking Soda and Lime can do this but I'm thinking you need to pH down before you feed and water.

RO/water mixed with your regular tap water I believe should bring your feeding and flushing PH down.

I hope Mr.furley and some other wizards and alchemists can chime in

Read the whole article but this section covers what I mean.,

NebulaHaze 's tutorial on pH http://www.growweedeasy.com/ph

No Need to Be Exact - Let pH Range Up & Down

The thing to remember with pH is that you don't need to be exact. What you do need to be is consistent in keeping the pH from creeping too high or too low in your plant root zone.

As long as you stick within the recommended pH ranges above, you will prevent the majority of all nutrient problems caused by too-high or too-low pH.

Why is it a good idea to let the pH cover a range instead of always adjusting to the exact same pH number? Some nutrients are better absorbed at slightly higher pH readings, while others are absorbed better at lower pH readings. Not having to try to pinpoint an exact number also saves a lot of unnecessary frustration.

If your marijuana plant roots are experiencing the wrong pH, it's recommended you react as soon as you notice, and not wait until you actually notice problems with the leaves. It can be tempting to ignore a pH problem, but you’ll often get the best results by acting before your plant displays a problem. That being said, if your plant is growing green, vibrant and healthy, sometimes the old saying applies, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it."

Tips

Be consistent in making sure pH stays in the range
You don’t need to be exact, just keep an eye on things and react if you notice the pH is getting too high or too low
Add all of your nutrients to your water first before checking and adjusting the pH. Your nutrients will affect the pH of your water so it's important they get added before making any adjustments.

**Cocho** · 01-28-2018, 02:06 PM

Yes, you've got it right. My tap water comes out at 8,5 from the spring in my kitchen. And when I add nutrients and such to it, it ranges about 7, but usually when I measure the run off, it comes out at 5,5 - 6,0. And I do this every second week or so. It has been like this since the early stages of veg stage. And I believe it's my fault actually. Because when I planted the seed, she was living in a small 1 liter (4 cups) pot, but after a few weeks she had this boom in root development, and because of some work stuff etc. experienced a situation where I either had to let her stay in the small pot for 3-4 days, even tho the roots were poking out underneath the pot. Or use the large 15 liters (4 gallon) pot I had standing here. And I didn't have time to buy a medium sized one, and the weekend was coming. Everything was kind of a "last resort", kind of a deal.

And because of that I believe something might have happened in the lower parts of the pot. Maybe it didn't dry up enough or something. Even tho I exercised great caution when watering her, only giving her the smallest amount of water every time. (To make sure I didn't provoke root rot or something like that).

But after a while I noticed some disturbances. And after some research and some careful handling of the plant, plus thrown a few questions at you guys. I decided to flush her, and hopefully clean out some salts or other bad stuff. She had a great recovery, and have been growing superbly since then. And every second week or so, I've been measuring the run off, just in case. And since that time she has been low on the pH-scale. So I've constantly kept an eye on her, and I've been ready to act if something were to develop. But nothing ever did. She's been healthy, good looking and over all a pretty plant. So I've not done anything about it. I bought a bag of dolomite, but ended up not using it after all, since it's a supplement for adding in to the soil, not to mix with the feeding water like I wanted to try.

So basically what I'm saying here is; that the tap water comes out at 8,5. But after I've added nutrients and stuff to it, it comes out at 7. And after a two weeks (2-3 feedings) the run off comes out at 5,5 - 6,0. Which I don't approve of.

So it's not such a big "swing". I was just unclear on the exact numbers.

And I've read most of the guides relevant to my project and my experience doing this project. Including the one you referred to right there. And that is why I've not "over reacted" about the pH values. Because in nature, nothing is totally accurate. Plus, if you grow in super soil you're never supposed to adjust the pH, since the soil will do that for you. I know this is not super soil, but someone told me to be a little careful not so mess up the natural balance in this organic soil mix. Because that usually makes things 100 times worse. So what I've done is regulate in the way I can, without messing with mother nature.

And I have some further information, which I acquired yesterday, and some of it today. Because yesterday I took away the ScrOG net, so that I could turn the plant around and really get a good look. And what I noticed was that the only leaves affected by the brown/orange dots, where the 3 I've already cut off. Non of the others have those. So they might have come from physical damage, cause by me. I don't have delicate hands. Mine a made for working with rocks and wood. Not trimming flowers. So they tend to get in my way when I try to cut away some of the leaves now and then. And sometimes I poke a stem, or scratch a leaf. Or it might have come from over feeding. Because today when I was getting ready to feed her, I noticed some burnt tips. Just 2 of them, but enough for me to realize that I had to make this mixture weaker than the last one.

So what I did was mixing 3 liters (12 cups) of water with; 3ml/L BioBloom, 1ml/L BioGrow, 1ml/L TopMax and 1 teaspoon of Molasses. But before I have her the "food", I gave her 6 liters (1,5 gallon) of pure water. And I took my time. Guess I spent 2 hours total, just giving her 1-2 liters at a time. And after I gave her the feeding water I did a measurement of the run off. And it came out at 6,0 - 6,5, which is good.

So now I'll be watching her carefully for the next week or so. She has some "symptoms" with the resemblance with those affected by this "mosaic virus". I mentioned it a few weeks ago. But then again, the symptoms might come from the pH. There's nothing to it. It's just some of the leaves. They look like they are in "50 shades of green". And according to the guide this might affect the yield, but if it is this "mosaic virus" there's nothing anyone can do about it. It's not toxic, and it won't harm anyone. It just might affect the yield.

Anyway. There's not much I can do at the moment. I'll just have to give her time. But the silver lining her is; there has been no new brown/orange spots anywhere, and the run off came out perfect.
So we're still kicking!

Thanks for the support guys. Keep the feedback coming! This is the final sprint, and this is where everything can (and will if I let it) go wrong.

Peace!

**Mr.furley** · 01-28-2018, 02:38 PM

Paracelsus, as I stir my coldrain and gaze into the Gwe.com crystal ball I see PH problems like this coming from needed to flush more/better or over feeding and not letting your pot go to runoff I personally dump a half gallon of flush water out once a week. The biggest problem with a high swing PH number like this is salt and Nute build up in the soil, not to mention simple Growers mistake can cause it, it happens. I would suspect what's going on is feeding at 8. is not allowing the plant to absorb and starting to get build-up from leftover nutrients the plant can't use, so s flush should fix this and let me reintegrate that this problem is not a major one yet, it is very minoot in early. in a ideal grow the number going in should be the number coming out if you start here and fight your darndest to keep it the here going in/out you'll have better control over your grow and a easier time. I will give a long babbling example of my last grow with Aurora indica and how a ph swing can grab your plant.
I was using ph tape and it started to run out so I bought some Gh drops and order a Tds meter and PH pen, trying to conserve tape I stopped measuring my out PH and keep feeding at the same in PH and nutes schedule and whatever I did with that week ( double dose of nudes ,forgot a flush, not reading the tape right I don't know) I started getting pH readings at 4 on my out pH with drops and 5 with the tape, I flushed for a week and got back to 6.3ph my plants got back to business. I now use ppm to determine the nutrient level coming out/in of my soil and gives me a clearer picture when to feed and went to stop it cannot stress more to calibrate your pins often.
The biggest thing I'm hoping to get across is that step number one when a grower see's the start of a nutrient deficiency or problem the first reaction is to add more nutes/ supplements or take it away but the course that should be followed is to make sure your pH is in check first. Calcium and magnesium need each other to absorb correctly in the plant one is absorb at 6. pH and the other is absorbance 6.3 so if your medium pH doesn't swing into that range you will not be absorbing them and only adding them to dump down the toilet or cause buildup, this is why my Target pH is 6.3 to absorb every nutrient in the schedule. I believe in my own grow experience that allowed when your pH to move through your pH Zone from time to time 5.5 to 6.5 in Coco, I personally stay in between 5.8 and 6.4 can allowing your pH to help absorb all of the nutrients around the board intern saving you money by not having to feed as much to waste. Make sense.
you are right that after the runoff pH is correct ph down is needed to start off on a good foot, and diluting with RO water can work the ratio is crazy, like 6 part R/o the 1 part tap water or something like that Imo.
hope this helps
Mr.furley, not really a wizard just a guy who likes plants!

**Cocho** · 02-02-2018, 01:47 PM

Time for a quick update guys!

As you know, last time I updated this thread, I had worries about some brown/orange spots showing up on some of the leaves.
I then decided to "clean" the soil my plant is growing in by giving her a good amount of clean water before feeding her.

Well.. after a few days I can report that the spots are still showing, also on leaves I'm pretty sure did not have any last time.
I also have some yellowing on some of the larger leaves, but I take that as totally normal. But I do not like the brown/orange spots!

So what I did today was give her clean water again, and let everything run through. After that I measured the pH of the run off, and it came out at 6,5.
I then continued with the feeding. I gave her the same dosage as last time, because when I tried to add more nutrients a few weeks ago, I got burned tips, and I don't want that.
So the mix was; 3ml/L BioBloom, 1ml/L BioGrow, 1ml/L TopMax and a teaspoon of Molasses.
When I was done feeding her I measured the run off again, and it came out at about pH 6. And I think it's a little too low, but what can I do? I can't keep giving her more water, so I guess I'll just have to wait until next feeding?

Anyways.. when I was done watering her I went on to cut away some of leaves that were covering bud sites, and also to cut of some of the leaves with "damage", so that I can show you guys.

Here you can see some of the leaves affected by the brown/orange spots. I have no idea what is causing this, and one of the leaves (the first picture) had a larger area almost at the base, which is worrying me even more.

And here's a few I took of the plant to show you the "damage".

As you can see, some of the growth have a lighter color than the rest. Do you think it might be something else causing the problems? I have been thinking that maybe she don't like the Molasses too good?
If I'm correct, the problems did not start to show before I had added the Molasses to the feeding schedule. Any thoughts? I'm kind of at a loss her. I can't figure out what the problem is.

I also took a few pictures of the plant as a whole. Just to show you the general state of her. She mostly looks healthy, and the majority of the leaves have a good color. Which is why this is all so odd.

So what do you guys think? Should I give her less nutrients next time, or do you think it's the pH still? I hope some of you have a clue, because I would hate for this whole project to end up in the toilet, just because of some spots without a origin.

Much love!

Peace.

**gbauto** · 02-02-2018, 04:23 PM

I do hydro, but she does look like she is a little hungry. Your leaf spots do look like the start of a Ca deficiency-I don't have any suggestions on how you would address that with your nutes. I have grown AI a couple of times, indoors and out and she is definitely a THUMPER. Your welcome.

**Locrian99** · 02-03-2018, 06:01 AM

I have no clue on what % you need for the calmag or if you can over do the molasses but the unsulphered molasses I have in my pantry contain calcium magnesium and iron.

**Cocho** · 02-03-2018, 06:26 AM

It's getting worse.

When I woke up today, the first thing I did was to check in on the plant. And the brown/orange spots are spreading, and soon every single leaf will be affected.
And there's nothing I can do about it.

At this rate, there will be nothing left when harvest comes..

She has stopped growing, so the buds are not getting bigger. The leaves are dying, soon they'll start falling off. Several of the leaves lower down on the plant have turned 100% yellow, and this is also affecting more and more leaves.

So I'm 2 seconds away from throwing the whole thing in the garbage. What a waste of time...

**DingusKhan** · 02-03-2018, 07:02 AM

Brother, settle down. It's not over yet. You can do this.

Milk is legal, even in Norway? just dilute it 1:4 parts water, adjust your ph. Some guys give even more milk than that. But if you're scared, go light, like a liter of milk in 8 or 10 liters of water, and adjust.

Remember, the spots that are on your leaves won't go away, they will get bigger an worse looking as the leaf grows, even if you've solved your problem. You need to look for new spots on new growth to know that you're still off kilter.

**Cocho** · 02-03-2018, 09:39 AM

Ok!

After several hours of "tinkering" with this little lady, I've managed to;

- Flush her (5-6 soakings in the shower)
- Add a new layer of soil (the soil is pH'ed to 6,3 when it's made)
- Mix 1dl (0,4 cups) of Milk to 3 liters (12 cups) of water, mixed with 1 teaspoon of Epsom salt, 3ml/L BioBloom, 1ml/L BioGrow, 1ml/L TopMax and a tiny teaspoon of Baking soda, just to "force" the pH of the feeding water a little higher than normal.

By doing this, my goal is to correct what ever it is that makes my soil so acidic, and at the same time, feed the poor thing.

Now I'll wait. Give her until tomorrow to recover. And hopefully she'll look a lot better then.

Thanks for all the help!

**DingusKhan** · 02-03-2018, 11:42 PM

Nice job, Cocho. I knew you could pull this together. I think what she really needs now is a good dry off period.

Sometimes, when I'm overwatering, I will stick some air hose several inches into the drain holes, or poke a little hole in the side of a smart pot and run air into the soil.

**starramus** · 02-04-2018, 09:14 AM

"So I'm 2 seconds away from throwing the whole thing in the garbage. What a waste of time..." That plant is a long way from death's door. Calm down...blow some weed. My vote is for the Epsom salts, but I wouldn't be administering the milk. Also that molasses by your olfactory intuition might contain sulphur. I'd get rid of that as well. It's always best to keep it simple stupid. By all means don't panic. You will harvest some very good weed from that plant.

**starramus** · 02-04-2018, 10:01 AM

Remember the plant is dying therefore the biological urge to reproduce. Humans and plants not so different.

**St.buds** · 02-04-2018, 12:57 PM

You should post some pics of what your plant looks like right now. The plant becomes more sensitive to ph in the flowering stage. I no its difficult to watch your plant you spent so much time money and effort on get sick and struggle to bring her health back but it can be done and even if u did end up with nothing from the plant you still had a growing experience and have new wisdom for your next grow.

**DingusKhan** · 02-09-2018, 01:55 AM

How's it going Cocho?

**Paracelsus** · 02-09-2018, 05:47 PM

Cocho Stay calm kiss is right. The smell of sulphuric farts could be a few things but mostly point to root rot and nutrient lock out from the cal mag Deficiency you’ve Been given some good pointers I hope You can save your girls remember KISS

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