FlyingDutchPaddy
New member
i've seen it as well, could be the flora micro thats settling. it is brown of color as well.
is there any water movement in the reservoir?
is there any water movement in the reservoir?
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First Time Grow DWC System, Viparspectra 600w LED
- Thread starter maner
- Start date
LurkingInTheGrass
New member
Hey maner
brown sediment is several things.
generally - the pH in my buckets drifts down. So, when my pH spikes - I look in the bucket for some physical contaminant.
(I am happy to explain how pH behaves for me, and how I try to use it)
Feeding your seedling
You are on track - at the moment, you are experiencing "growing" pains LOL (taking your lumps, inquiring, figuring out how they grow, what works best for them/you)
It takes a lot to really kill one of these plants - so there is time to correct any miss-steps
​​​​​​​
sorry for the ramble, may or may not be cannabis inspired
brown sediment is several things.
- It comes from the micro nutrients (as mentioned above).
- its quite dark and thick with goodness (almost gritty)
- if you only shake 1 bottle before use, please shake the micro
- It comes from the hydroton (expanded clay pellets). you have to rinse and rinse and rinse, before you get all the red dust off and rinse
- It comes from your the Great White doing its job
- generally cleaning up the reservoir. eating, drinking, making baby enzymes, taking out the bad guys, etc
- bucket temperature
- cool reservoir
- cool water (physically) can hold more oxygen. more oxygen at the roots makes happy cannabis plants
- bad enzymes/bacteria prefer warm water (they don't want to stop in a cool res)
- warm reservoir
- warm water can't hold enough oxygen for any plants - the plants end up suffocating because they can't get enough oxygen
- bad for roots
- think sous vide - slowly cooking tender roots in warm water
- encourages bad enzymes/bacteria
- when my buckets are too warm - I have more sediment than usual and/or brown slime
- cool reservoir
- Hydrogen Peroxide (H2O3)
- until it has expired, peroxide 'cleans' (oxidizes organic matter until the H2O3 becomes H2O). The good, the bad and the ugly - it also cleans the roots, contributing to the sediment
- when expired - it is just water (H2O). at the very most - a glass of (strong) peroxide can last 24 hours before becoming water. please, don't drink the peroxide
generally - the pH in my buckets drifts down. So, when my pH spikes - I look in the bucket for some physical contaminant.
- It could be anything (leaf and leaf goo is what I find in my res) floating or stuck to the netpot stuck to your air tubing, under the airstone. look everywhere.
- I once found a leaf that had somehow wedged its stem into the netpot - so it was bobbing in and out of the water.
- It could be to much water in the reservoir
- water surface shouldn't touch the netpot
- aeration actually takes too much water onto the hydroton - causing the hydroton in the netpot to be too wet (leave some headroom between bottom of netpot and surface of reservoir)
(I am happy to explain how pH behaves for me, and how I try to use it)Feeding your seedling
- as you can see, the general consensus is you started your nutrient regime, a little early.
- No Biggie. just keep an eye on your leaf tips
- For me - I don't use nutrients (other than CALiMAGic and Armor Si) until I have "roots in the nutes"
- until roots are in the reservoir - no sense in putting anything else in (spending money, for nothing)
- and I mean ROOTS (not 1 or 2 little ones, barely touching the surface either a good number of roots, or deep into the reservoir)
- and I mean ROOTS (not 1 or 2 little ones, barely touching the surface
- by the time roots are in the reservoir - she has a couple sets of leaves and is ready for something a little richer than CALiMAGic
- until roots are in the reservoir - no sense in putting anything else in (spending money, for nothing)
You are on track - at the moment, you are experiencing "growing" pains LOL (taking your lumps, inquiring, figuring out how they grow, what works best for them/you)
It takes a lot to really kill one of these plants - so there is time to correct any miss-steps
​​​​​​​
sorry for the ramble, may or may not be cannabis inspired
SirSmksAlot
New member
That was very informative! Thanks for that
RagWeedDWC
New member
LurkingInTheGrass, currently I maintain mine between 68 and 70F, was considering going lower. Do you know what the recommended temp is? I know what Mr. Google states, but... you know... it is the internet...
LurkingInTheGrass
New member
RagWeedDWC
Nebula's recommendations (https://www.growweedeasy.com/deep-water-culture-faqs)
"I personally have found that hydroponic plants tend to grow a little slower when their roots are cool, and grow fastest around 75°F (as long as you're using a supplement with beneficial organisms to kill root rot).
In short:
Maintain the temps in your grow room and the reservoir is fine
I personally have found hydroponic plants tend to grow the fastest when the temperature is between 73-80°F, with 75°F being a good temperature to aim for. However, with warmer temps make sure you're using a beneficial bacteria supplement to prevent root rot!"
What works for me:
I like to try to keep my res temps around 68-69F. If I am running more than 70F - I add more Bennies (beneficial bacteria\enzymes)
summer time is harder (some people will freeze small water bottles and put them in their Res, to keep temps down)
if I get much higher than 73F, the roots and reservoir don't like it (in my system), and I end up with problems (and a smelly res).
It also means my grow tent/room is too hot
Causes of high res temp
ambient temperature:
grow room/tent is to warm, lights are to low.
water pumps:
are you using a pump to recirculate water? they generate heat (you might need to increase your reservoir size, to accommodate a larger water pump)
air pump:
these generate heat, then pump that heat directly into your reservoir, transfering the heat from the air bubbles to the reservoir
add a little more air line length between the pump and the res
Nebula's recommendations (https://www.growweedeasy.com/deep-water-culture-faqs)
"I personally have found that hydroponic plants tend to grow a little slower when their roots are cool, and grow fastest around 75°F (as long as you're using a supplement with beneficial organisms to kill root rot).
In short:
Maintain the temps in your grow room and the reservoir is fine
I personally have found hydroponic plants tend to grow the fastest when the temperature is between 73-80°F, with 75°F being a good temperature to aim for. However, with warmer temps make sure you're using a beneficial bacteria supplement to prevent root rot!"
What works for me:
I like to try to keep my res temps around 68-69F. If I am running more than 70F - I add more Bennies (beneficial bacteria\enzymes)
summer time is harder (some people will freeze small water bottles and put them in their Res, to keep temps down)
if I get much higher than 73F, the roots and reservoir don't like it (in my system), and I end up with problems (and a smelly res).
It also means my grow tent/room is too hot
Causes of high res temp
ambient temperature:
grow room/tent is to warm, lights are to low.
water pumps:
are you using a pump to recirculate water? they generate heat (you might need to increase your reservoir size, to accommodate a larger water pump)
air pump:
these generate heat, then pump that heat directly into your reservoir, transfering the heat from the air bubbles to the reservoir
add a little more air line length between the pump and the res
maner
New member
thank you so much for your broad and informative post, i will change the reservoir tonight and make a week 3 post with photos, one of my plant (BBSC) has some soft white spots on it (maybe because of pH fluctations, cause i didnt check pH in the first whole week unfortunatelly) but Kilimanjaro looks so healthy with good green and so symmetrical leaves.
- i always shake nutrients well before i add them to the reservoir, should i mix nutrients in another bottle (with adding micro first) and then put it in reservoir water?
- i think that brown residue comes from hydrotons according to the infomations you gave because i washed them just before i start like 2-3 minutes.
-pH fluctations: before i start i have measured net pot levels and drew MIN-MAX water levels (you can see the residue picture i sent at the bottom right) according to informations that i learnt from this site (2-4" air gap is it right)
-im very curious, for my next grows, dont you add ANY nutrients (according to nebulas schedule 1/4 dose of flora trio first week) except calimagic and armor si? only pH water??
- i always shake nutrients well before i add them to the reservoir, should i mix nutrients in another bottle (with adding micro first) and then put it in reservoir water?
- i think that brown residue comes from hydrotons according to the infomations you gave because i washed them just before i start like 2-3 minutes.
-pH fluctations: before i start i have measured net pot levels and drew MIN-MAX water levels (you can see the residue picture i sent at the bottom right) according to informations that i learnt from this site (2-4" air gap is it right)
-im very curious, for my next grows, dont you add ANY nutrients (according to nebulas schedule 1/4 dose of flora trio first week) except calimagic and armor si? only pH water??
RagWeedDWC
New member
Until the roots are in the water, at best I feed 1/4 strength, but usually just Rapid Start from GH, my reservoir is 6 gal, but I use the recomended dosage for 5 gals (2 teaspoons) and hydroguard. not sure how effective hydroguard is with out any roots, but it seems to help. Once roots go into water, I feed for one week half strength and then go into my feeding schedule.
maner
New member
Week 3 (04.02.2019)
Weekly change of reservoir done, brown sediment was less than 4 days ago ( i started to put ice bottles daily or twice a day maybe it affected)
water solution:
- 10ml pH down
- 20ml Flora trio (micro-gro-bloom)
- 5ml Great White Mic.
Final rates (30L):
- 6.11pH 677ppm (NaCl)
-RH: 45%
-Temperature: 23° C
-Reservoir Temperature: 21°C
-LED disctance: 75cm - 29,5"
Weekly change of reservoir done, brown sediment was less than 4 days ago ( i started to put ice bottles daily or twice a day maybe it affected)
water solution:
- 10ml pH down
- 20ml Flora trio (micro-gro-bloom)
- 5ml Great White Mic.
Final rates (30L):
- 6.11pH 677ppm (NaCl)
-RH: 45%
-Temperature: 23° C
-Reservoir Temperature: 21°C
-LED disctance: 75cm - 29,5"
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LurkingInTheGrass
New member
maner
New member
-12 hours later, after the reservoir change i checked the pH and it was 7.90 (at 12.30 pm). 7ml pH down added to a little RO water mixed and added to reservoir, new pH was 6.49, 674PPM
-checked ph again at 8.30pm it was: pH 7.10 , 3ml pH down added to a little RO water mixed and added to reservoir, new pH was 6.11, 680PPM
is this much fluctation normal? i just changed the reservoir water yesterday cleaned every tube and nearly everything.
- Are my roots ok?
-checked ph again at 8.30pm it was: pH 7.10 , 3ml pH down added to a little RO water mixed and added to reservoir, new pH was 6.11, 680PPM
is this much fluctation normal? i just changed the reservoir water yesterday cleaned every tube and nearly everything.
- Are my roots ok?
Attachments
Eliot Pryor
New member
I use regular tap water and I don't get that much movement. I think my tap water is very good the PPM is about 170 the PH is 7.0. In my dwc setup 1 ml of ph down per gallon drops 1 point. Your roots look great !!
maner
New member
Guys i have some questions and one of them is important because one of my plant (Big Buddha Silver Cheese) has some reactions on it's leaves, i haven't figured out against what and i need your help.
- Im sending pictures of BBSC's leaves hope we can understand what it is there is also a little hole on the leaf you can see that in the picture which i put my finger backside of it, i also attached the Kilimanjaro as last picture
- havent figured out why i still have pH fluctations yet but after 2 interventions of taking pH to desired levels reservoir water's pH nearly stabilizes, i use min 2 different water sources while im preparing solution, because my water purifier gives me high ppm levels, can it be the reason?
- Height of my plants are still 2-3" is this normal?
- Im sending pictures of BBSC's leaves hope we can understand what it is there is also a little hole on the leaf you can see that in the picture which i put my finger backside of it, i also attached the Kilimanjaro as last picture
- havent figured out why i still have pH fluctations yet but after 2 interventions of taking pH to desired levels reservoir water's pH nearly stabilizes, i use min 2 different water sources while im preparing solution, because my water purifier gives me high ppm levels, can it be the reason?
- Height of my plants are still 2-3" is this normal?
Attachments
I was having huge ph fluctuations in my first month as well. I think it may have been the tote being new because after about a month it slowed down quite a bit. Now it seems that i will change out the res with solution ph'd to 5.5, after a night it'll usually have raised by about 1, I'll ph it back down to around 5.7ish and then it'll usually settle in around 6.2 for the rest of the week. I also had some small dead looking spots on the first couple nodes leaves, not sure what the deal was but the newer leaves that came in were fine after that.
I think i went through a 1/3 of a bottle of ph down in the first month alone. Now i usually use about 3 capfulls between the initial PHing of the solution and adjusting after each res change. (I usually change every week, 15 gallons of water)
I think i went through a 1/3 of a bottle of ph down in the first month alone. Now i usually use about 3 capfulls between the initial PHing of the solution and adjusting after each res change. (I usually change every week, 15 gallons of water)
FlyingDutchPaddy
New member
i've seen similar fluctuations with pH, in that when i change the water i bring it down to 5.8 ish.
couple of days later it was up near 7.0.
added extra pH down and seems stable at 6.1 (last 2 days)
im using pH down from GH now.... supposedly made with "food grade" acids.
before i had pH down from Essentials, and that was much more stable imo.
couple of days later it was up near 7.0.
added extra pH down and seems stable at 6.1 (last 2 days)
im using pH down from GH now.... supposedly made with "food grade" acids.
before i had pH down from Essentials, and that was much more stable imo.
BlueBudz
New member
It may help you to have some water set aside with an air stone in it for a day or two before you add to res. Balance and stabilize levels before doing your weekly res change. This will prevent the plant from suffering major ph swings(leaf spots) hope this helps
ps I find even an hour or two does the trick
ps I find even an hour or two does the trick
maner
New member
i have antoher box for reservoir so i prepare my new water solution it. it wont be an issue to keep airstone in it for 1 day but i dont have extra airpump and im confused a bit, its not enough to keep airstone in water right? i also should turn on another airpump and connect the airstone to that?
- do you think those reactions because of pH fluctations, and that little hole?
- im in the middle of the 3rd week, what do you think about the growth of my plants? are they on track or not grown enough compared to 3rd week plant?
- do you think those reactions because of pH fluctations, and that little hole?
- im in the middle of the 3rd week, what do you think about the growth of my plants? are they on track or not grown enough compared to 3rd week plant?
maner
New member
my pH down is home made which a store here made it and there is no brand, can that cause fluctations also?
it stabilizes after 2 interventions in first 1-2 days.
- do you think those colour fluctations and hole on leaves because of pH fluctations?
- im in the middle of the 3rd week, what do you think about the growth of my plants? are they on track or not grown enough compared to 3rd week plant?
it stabilizes after 2 interventions in first 1-2 days.
- do you think those colour fluctations and hole on leaves because of pH fluctations?
- im in the middle of the 3rd week, what do you think about the growth of my plants? are they on track or not grown enough compared to 3rd week plant?
FlyingDutchPaddy
New member
i don't know how much of a difference home-made pH down would be compared to that what you can buy 'branded'.
Seems that most of the commercial pH down solutions are "food grade" phosphoric acids (the Essentials one is 81%).
Reading up online would suggest that 'extreme' fluctuations or sudden changes of pH are associated with the need to change the water, or at least, new nutrients are needed.
color fluctuations & hole in leaves
- quite possible, but I can't say for certain.
Growth rate of your plants
- see my post below, as I can't put pictures in the comments.
Seems that most of the commercial pH down solutions are "food grade" phosphoric acids (the Essentials one is 81%).
Reading up online would suggest that 'extreme' fluctuations or sudden changes of pH are associated with the need to change the water, or at least, new nutrients are needed.
color fluctuations & hole in leaves
- quite possible, but I can't say for certain.
Growth rate of your plants
- see my post below, as I can't put pictures in the comments.
FlyingDutchPaddy
New member
Maner, sorry for 'hijacking' your grow thread with pictures of mine, but its to indicate potential growth rates as asked.
1st is 2 days after transplant,
2nd is 1 week after,
3rd is 2 wks after,
4th is almost 3 wks in,
5th is 4 wks + 3 days.
average temp : 14C - 18C
RH: 50 - 70 %
as an additional FYI, I have my lights on constantly since planting into the pebbles.
1st is 2 days after transplant,
2nd is 1 week after,
3rd is 2 wks after,
4th is almost 3 wks in,
5th is 4 wks + 3 days.
average temp : 14C - 18C
RH: 50 - 70 %
as an additional FYI, I have my lights on constantly since planting into the pebbles.
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Eliot Pryor
New member
Perhaps when I commented about my water I should have mentioned that I keep several 1 gallon milk jugs on the floor all the time. It lets it get stable I think.