Beet Top Curly Virus or a Bug?

[golfnrl]

The pics are of a Purple Haze/Malawi sativa and her tent mate, a Strawberry Cough sativa leaning hybrid. The PH/M is slow growing, seems stunted, the leaves are like crepe paper, the yellow in the leaves, and the curly tops make me think BTCV, but then I noticed what appears to be bite marks from some bug or critter. The last pic is the Strawberry Cough. That one looks good but I'm starting to see some discoloration in the leaves, but the plant doesn't seem to be stunted or slow growing. Any suggestions? Maybe a bath with either Neem Oil or Lost Coast Plant Therapy? If it's BTCV I need to chop it. If it's a bug I don't mind doing battle with 'em.

Grow conditions are good. Temps high 70's lights on low 70's lights off. RH 50-60% lights on 50% lights off. Nutes at full strength. The 50/50 coco/perlite blend is recycled with about 1/4 of the coco being fresh. The fabric pot is on it's second or third grow. Everything got a thorough wash and cleaning before re-use.

[Rwise]

I hate to say it but I dont see bug damage, looks more like wind damage, and the pics in the Plant Dr look much like this for BCTV.

[Gingerbeard]

No idea. Gonna watch.
I get and see in the forum pictures of all sorts of discolorations and twistings like that. In my own personal experience that I am not suggesting is the case in this case, ride it out and see what happens.

[Going2fast]

Both tentmates? Russet mites possibly. Lost three plants outdoors years ago because I would tend to them at the same time thus spreading them. Thought tobacco mosaic or something until I realized my others weren't affected. Twisted slow yellowing growth but can't see anything on the leaves. I don't know of a surefire treatment.

[golfnrl]

I'll look closer for a mite infestation. The rez PH for some reason is kind of unstable for this grow. What I mean is, I have PH dialed in with the controller at 5.8. Normally, there's very little fluctuation. This time I'm seeing a drop down to 5.4-5.6 frequently, but not daily. A quick stir and the PH rises. Imma switch out the rez to clean it. I'm wondering of there's a PH problem or a root issue. My doubt about the PH being an issue stems from both plants are feeding from the same rez.

[Bluey]

I'd be dropping nutes back to half strength. They look packed with N but it doesn't look like typical N toxicity.

Probably won't hurt to give them a spray of the neem if that doesn't help.

[golfnrl]

I'd be dropping nutes back to half strength. They look packed with N but it doesn't look like typical N toxicity.

Probably won't hurt to give them a spray of the neem if that doesn't help.

I buffered the coco with cal/mag after I washed/recycled it. Didn't consider they may be N toxic just because the leaves don't look like the picture on the GWE site. I can cut the nutes back, NP. I'll give it a go and see what happens.

[golfnrl]

I noticed what appears to me to be more bite marks. IDK. After a thorough exam with a magnifying glass I found nothing moving, wiggling, or hiding. Gave a healthy Neem bath to both girls. Cleaned the rez and reduced the strength of the nutrient solution. Took off a little foliage as well.

[Gingerbeard]

I'm calling picture 1 a tear.
Those holes, man. I get those holes, but I do not have bugs. I tear, bend, bruise, and otherwise flail my damaged leaves and know what the damage looks like. I cannot figure out those holes except that they are not bug holes.

[golfnrl]

I hear ya. Not saying the leaf ain't torn. But there's missing plant matter in the tear area. If it's torn I wonder what might be the cause. It's on a part of the plant right next to the tent wall and the air movement is not excessive. I've not seen holes in my plant's leaves before. But not seeing any evidence of bugs either.

[Rwise]

I would call both wind damage, the tear could be from handling or many other issues, the holes look to be from another leaf rubbing it, I see this with outside plan often.

[golfnrl]

Understood about the possible causes for the 'tear.' We'll see how it goes.

[golfnrl]

OK. I have another grow going along with this one. The attached pic is from that tent. Notice the holes? It appears Rwise and Gingerbeard are correct about the holes and the wind. Lesson learned. I now have a better understanding of too much air I guess.

I did notice brown spots on the top most fan leaves today. I switched out the solution in the rez to PH'd water only, Imma let that ride a couple of days and then lower the nutes some more. Bluey I'm wondering if the issue here is root related maybe from wide swings in the PH?

[Bluey]

Wide swings in pH does cause leaf problems that vary but splotches of color change may be and are related to that.

You need to focus on getting the pH in range and the nutes at a happy level. Make sure you have a reliable pH meter. Apera PH60 appears to be the gold standard and calibrate it as required. My probe storage solution is pH 4.00 and when I see the numbers start drifting away from that I refresh the storage solution first and if it is much off 4.00 I recalibrate it using calibration fluid which will bring it back to perfect accuracy if the probe is still good. Probes need changing every year or two.

When I've given nutes at the manufacturers recommended levels its almost killed my plants...so my experience has been to use between half to no more than about 75% recommended amounts for best results, and it varies dependant upon every other factor in the equation, eg., light, environment, CO² levels, medium, genetics, plant mass, etc.. I grow in coco. You'd use even less in good soil.

[golfnrl]

Understood. I use BlueLab equipment for both pen and controller for the reservoir. I think they are within their shelf life. I will check the purchase date and consult the Bluelab web site. I've had the same experience with nutrients being too much for the plant. I've been growing with CX Horticulture brand nutrients for a few years. I start my sprouts off with plain PH'd water, followed by nutes at 1/4-1/3 strength, then 1/2, then 3/4, then full. When I say full strength I mean 1M/l per liter max for the base and growth enhancer. CX recommends 1-5M/L per liter. That's too much. I've had success with this system and am stumped why I have a single plant that is having Issues. I've had these girls on plain water for two days. I am going to change that to a low level solution and see what happens. The sick plant has a tent mate that is growing somewhat slowly but isn't showing any symptoms of anything it doesn't like.

[golfnrl]

Some pics of the brown spots I mentioned yesterday. Grow temps and RH are in range. PH is 5.8. I've had some fluctuation and have recalibrated both the PH controller and the PH pen. They are both reading the same. I think most of the PH drift seems to be happening between the times I have the circulating pump set to run in the reservoir. I'll play around with it a little bit and see what happens.

[Bluey]

If you're using a reservoir and circulting you will need to adjust pH often. With an airstone in the resvoir and pump I've seen pH rise from 5.8 to over 6.7 in 24 hours. Other times I've seen it barely change and I've also seen it drop especially with well developed clones with roots immersed in the reservoir so attention here is critical to healthy plants.

[golfnrl]

I don't use an air stone in the rez because when I did I experienced too much drift in the PH. I use a small aquarium pump set to run 8 times a day for a few mins per. The drift for me is down not up. Water comes out of the tap where I am at 7.0. I use GH PH Down to get it in range when mixing. I will set the PH controller at different levels during the grow but always within the 5.8-6.1 for coco coir.

[golfnrl]

The sick plant is recovering nicely. No sign of distress in the new growth. I'll up date pics of her tomorrow.

Today there was a revolting development. Take a look at the pics. I had a fox in the hen house. Ugh. I looked him over and didn't see any pollen sacs broken open. I hope he didn't pollenate his tent mate, or contaminate the lung room, or the plants in the other tent. This is a first for me. I felt like I needed a tyvek suit on cause I didn't want to get any of his 'stuff' on me. I'm shocked at the speed this guy showed his balls. I defoliated both plants in the tent just about 48 hours ago and there was def no sign of this, just the beginnings of pre-flowers. I check them daily. Sometimes more than once. I feel cheated.

[Smallgrow]

Wow that seems fast , were those regular seeds ?

[golfnrl]

Nope. I sprouted what was supposed to be a Strawberry Cough Photo/Fem that I have had a while. I think it came from ILGM. I have more of them. I'm thinking the percentages caught up with me.

[Rwise]

What a pretty boy, sorry.

[Bluey]

Who's ya daddy?

[golfnrl]

---

Today about 45 minutes from lights on. She's just about totally recovered. You can see yellow veins on a couple of the lower fans. Those are the last ones from the disastrous start. She's been on 1/2 strength nutrients. The Ace grow guide says she will like strong nutrients and light. Her nutrient solution will go up from 50% to about 80% the next feed. The 350R is 15" above at 5 clicks on a 10 click scale. This light is intense. It may not go above the 5, IDK yet. If I decide to increase the intensity I will raise the lamp a bit to try and avoid light burn. She hasn't really started the stretch yet. I'm curious how she will do.

[Bluey]

That's a sudden increase of EC from about 1.2 to 1.9 in one go. That's a big jump and you risk burning her badly.

[golfnrl]

Noted on the EC. She's had a rough go as it is. I don't want to contribute to her issues. I'll watch the EC on the next mix. I don't usually do that. Just for grins I checked the EC in the rez, 1.7 right now.