HELP! Yet another grow problem

[dieselguy1969]

As much as i hate to be the new guy posting pictures of yet another seemly simple problem... Here i am. leaves curling up and brown tips.

I have spent hours and hours looking at pictures and reading forums on what can cause this. Over watering, Under watering , high-temp, nutrient burn , root rot , genetics and many others.

This is the 6th plant i have grown with the same problem. First plants were free seeds. These are bought Bruce Banner. Indoor Grow . Temp range of 73-81 Average temp 77.8 . Humidity range 58-62 average 60.8 . Vpd range 1.0-1.8 average 1.6 . 750ml of water every 2-3 days (using finger to first knuckle to check for soil moisture). ph is around 6.3 to 6.5 when tested. Growing in store bought organic compost soil (none of the special kinds as im not in a friendly state) mixed with coco coir in roughly 3 gallon pots.

I have tried everything i know to do with each plant i have tried. Water more, water less, More nutrients less nutrients.Trying each thing per plant to see what happens. Only things i know to do next is change soil and strongly thinking just moving to hydro.

I have been at this well over a year as i did not want to ask for help but i am obviously missing something or not going far enough with my adjustments. If anyone has any advice or ideas please let me know

[Bluey]

What I am seeing here is perhaps a slightly too hot soil mix and perhaps a bit much watering but it is minor in both regards.

Did things get worse on the last growsat this stage moving forwards?

You could try reducing it your light a fraction and the top end of the VPD bring it down if you can. That is very very high at this stage

[dieselguy1969]

Normally from this point it was only downhill for the last grows.Drooping should come in next and then leaves will probably turn yellow. Light is 200w led adjustable spectrum running at 100% 24/7. Ill try bumping it down to 90%

Ive been worried about the high vpd readings and been trying to get something figured out. Its in a room off the end of the house that doesn't get good a/c been looking at putting a booster in the vent as that should bring temp and humidity down and i believe lower vpd .

[SoOrbudgal]

Did you say what it is strain wise a photoperiod or auto ?

[dieselguy1969]

Pictures from a previous grow. I believe this was grow number 3 . These were test seeds given to me but also hermie and bad genetics

[No3odiesShad0w]

Those are some unhappy and unhealthy looking plants. That's why they hermed on you. Either the length of light or the intensity.... My most recent Blue Dream hermed out on me and I think it's because of light intensity too late into bloom. Worst part I didn't even notice it until I trimmed...
I think you're using some bag compost or Coco. I know you're in a nope state so you have to be clever. You can always get dirt shipped via Amazon 🤣🤣 they shipped me over 500lbs of dirt over the years. 1x 2cu ft bag at a time. Throw in a pack of tomatoes seeds with your order. Sprout the tomatoes when you get your soil. Use the soil for the weed. If anyone asks what you're doing, your bring it the tomatoes seedlings and tell them, growing food and show them the seedlings.

[Bluey]

Anything over 1.6 on the VPD without CO² is going to stress them and start a cycle of unexpected nute problems and the higher you go the worse it gets. They also get tired Luke in your pics.

[Mr.furley]

You need to dim your light to 50% to 60% and raise it until you recover your plants or you will just keep repeating the same out come! 24/7? So they get no sleep? That soil mix sounds HOT! So what is the only consistent through the last six grows? The same soil? The same experimentation with different water frequencies, different nutrient levels.

The plants are squatty with dark green leaves, tip burn and Taco leaves.
1) improper pH
2) nutrient toxicity (compost is hot)
3) light burn (24/7- 100%)
4) high temperatures or large swings (no mention of ventilation)

If you're repeatedly losing plants then you have to answer the question as to why, what is the consistent problem. True value or ace usually sells Fox Farm or promix products.

By the way Autos or Photos?

[Gingerbeard]

You are using self-watering pots. Or whatever those are called. I'll bet a nickel you have super-hot swamp water in the reservoirs and rotting roots.
Starting from seed in hot soil is a thing. The soil will flush the hots as the plant grows.

[Sixwinds]

All this is good advice, but I'd add they look light/heat damaged to me. Remember you can always try out Coco/perlite before going full hydro.

[Gingerbeard]

Do you have fans and ventilation? Do you keep your tent closed with the light on?

[Rwise]

Even autos do better with 4 hours sleep.

[User420111]

Ditto on the soil being hot. But I will throw my 2 cents into the ring and opine that 24 hours of light is not a problem. I've been doing it this way for years and never an issue. There is plenty of literature out there to explain why plants to not "need sleep". They are factories, that's it. When the lights are on, the workers are working. When the lights are off the workers are not working. Period. That's the simplest way I can explain it without going into the details of photosynthesis and stored glucose. But if you want to dive into that rabbit hole at some point, I advise it, and simply start with a Google search of the phrase "do plants need sleep?".


Best of luck!

[Sixwinds]

Interesting debate, I lean on the 6 hours of rest per day side. The one time I left the lights on for 24/7 the plants looked really tired. I tend to go by look/feel of the plant and to me they looked overworked. Keep in mind this has nothing to do with science - just my opinion from experience.

[User420111]

Of course everyone is entitled to grow it their own way, that's fine. But unlike animals with central nervous systems plants don't need rest at all. Why would they? If the argument is they need time to recover well look at it this way; What helps a plant recover fastest? Availability of energy! Again, unlike mammals, amphibians, birds, etc... a plant doesn't need to lie down and take a nap. Counterintuitively... a plant, when it needs to repair itself, actually benefits from being "awake", for lack of a better term. It will literally heal itself faster while the lights are on because the powerhouse that makes it function is being fed. A plant will literally "recover" slower while the lights are off because it is now resorting to using its stored energy reserves and therefore depleting itself of the energy it needs to grow. Whereas having the lights ON is akin to (if you'll forgive a non-scientific analogy) Superman being in the sunlight when he gets hurt. The radiation of the yellow star gives him the energy he needs to heal faster. I'm sure Stan Lee would cuss me out for presuming Superman CAN get hurt, but you get the idea.

Anyway, as I mentioned the rabbit hole is something fun to go down if you're into botany and biology and the science of growing.

[No3odiesShad0w]

When the plants are as stressed as they are.... The 24 hours of light isn't helping anything.

[dieselguy1969]

The plants are feminized photos. There is a 5 inch high power ventilation fan and ducting with a scrubber canister filter. Fan is set up as Run at speed one unless temp is over 77 then increase speed. Humidity over 70% increase speed. Temp under 70 turn fan off(use light to increase temp)(never happens). Fan on ten will almost bend the metal frame of the tent.

The soil is the only thing consistent across all grows. In the last two grows i pulled the roots and checked after i killed the plant off. Most of the roots looked good with ones at the very bottom of the pot having a very very slight brown hue. The roots did seem kinda tightly packed are 3 gallon pots enough?

Closest place that sells fox farm per there website is almost 100 miles away. I dont really mind the drive just getting a chance to do it.

I am running the lights 24/7 as thats what i read in the weed bible(doesnt mean its right but i rolled with it). i did 20/4 on the last grow with no change in results.

i have measured ph so many times i cant count. From water going it to soil and water mix to runoff. It always checks good in low to mid 6.

I actually start the seeds in a small hydo unit for growing fresh herbs(basil parsley...). I have had a 95% germination rate in it and the seedlings always look great. Its normally 2 weeks after transplant that problems start.which is where this plant is at.

Im gonna cut my lights down some more and see what happens. This weekend im going to find some different soil and different pots and see if i can get a few clones to root and try those as well.
i have also ordered a vent booster fan to try and keep the temp and humidity down in the room .If i can keep the temp close to the rest of the house i can have a vpd of about 1.3

I really appreciate the help. Im going to try and keep updating this and hopefully help someone else out in the future once i narrow the problem down

[Rwise]

I tend to agree that the soil is to hot, the lights are to hot. I would cut the lights to 18/6 and reduce the intensity of them, keep the PH at 6.3-6.5 in veg.
3 gallon pots should be good for a short run (with added nutes) such as switch to 12/12s at 3-5 weeks old, if your gonna go for bigger plants, bigger pots will help. My outdoor pots are like 135+ gallon, more like raised beds. I also start my seeds in their final home no transplanting so no root damage.

[No3odiesShad0w]

I'm curious about nutrients you might be using. Is it just a compost/Coco mix? Any perlite? Is the compost your main source of fertilizer or are you adding something else? The compost might be high in nitrogen and potassium. There might also be a decent amount of salt in there. They look like the plants I tried growing in miracle-gro soil. I wish you the best of luck.

[Radeon]

1)change soil (I use DNC water only, no need for nutrients or PH checking) Find it many places online.

2) get a proper light meter. I just love it when there is so much advice on PH checking and light adjustment (including distance) but with light intensity your guessing? Makes a whole lot of sense. Without a meter is like trying to determine the sex of a baby by looking at how big the woman's stomach is. You'll use it more than you know. Every inch that plant grows, ppfd increases and distance to light shortens. I check mine and adjust light every watering. You would be surprised just how much light intensity increases every 48 hours, ESPECIALLY after flip. Which leads me to my next piece of advice:

3) check temps at CANOPY level,. 78 AVERAGE tent temp could mean 85-90 at canopy level even with led. Believe me, I found out quickly that my new light was more intense than my last. Even though both are led. Tent temp can sometimes be deceiving.

Its called "cupping" or "canoeing". If you want to google it use those terms.

If you order from Amazon it comes in a box with no labeling. They ain't coming after you for 1 bag of potting soil. Can you imagine how many people would be raided for simply buying a bag of potting soil? Cops got better things to do, trust me.