Never adjust pH again? Yes it can be done by building your own soil! It's EZ!

[TOKABIGONE]

Sound like a fantasy? Nope it's for real! I'm just finishing my first grow with this and that is exactly what I did with fantastic results! I'll show a pic in a minute. I've been thinking about this for months now and doing my research. If you have looked at my current grow thread "Autotoka grow..." you have an idea how this works. I'm not writing this to show off but to provoke some discussion as I'm sure I'm not the only person to try this with success but few are talking about it. All the info on my recipe is in that thread at the very start so I'm not gonna repeat it here. I am hoping to stir some interest and questions about the process by making folks think about it and those who are doing it now to share their ideas. Honest it's not rocket science. NEVER check or adjust pH again? What a dream! The most important element in your new soil is your microbe colony. Yep them are the little critters that attach themselves and grow on the root system and throughout your soil to take up your raw nutes and convert them to a form the plants can readily use so pH becomes unimportant. Yes, I said that, unimportant! I add a lot to mine and top dress too. This is a symbiotic process as they don't eat the soil nutes but form colonies on the roots where they trade the converted nutes for sugar the plant produces and then moves it down to the roots to feed the colonies. Unsulfered molasses is one of their favorites so I give it generously. Some types grow threads that can become miles long and research has proven that they can actually communicate over great distances, What they say to each other I will leave to your imagination.
The companies that make and sell products for cannabis growing have discovered a gold mine in creating a myriad of products for pH control and chemical nutrients that are mostly water with those things added in varying amounts. NPK and trace minerals are the basic needs for plants but they have made a thousand variations for mixing them in order to sell more, make more. Don't believe me...go look at your supply cabinet. How many bottles of crap have you been seduced into buying? Plants have been growing in earth for hundreds of millions of years with out the chemical junk we're told we must have. Soil has a natural way of correcting your pH to a healthy level and you can mimic it relatively inexpensively just by blending a few organic and mineral products at the start and then feed with teas and top dressings. FF Coco Loco and a few others are mixing and selling these exact products but the problem is they add so little that they will support a mature plant for only a couple weeks. I started with FFCL then bought and added more of the same ingredients they did plus a few more I think necessary. Yes you will need to buy some dry organic products but good news is all is reusable many times if refreshed and remixed for each new grow and you already have the stuff to do it. It's absolutely silly to throw away perfectly good grow medium and buy more even if you throw it in the garden. For most of us this is the only garden we have. I hope we have a good discussion on this soon so please contribute any thoughts or experiences you have. My mix is far from perfect so It will continue to evolve during many grows to come. Happy and easy Pharming!!

Here's that pic and there are more in the grow thread:
(Oh no, they're all yellow! Relax it's normal end fade, lol)

[Farmbuck]

No it's not a fantasy but a reality. As you know sir this was my first auto grow and my first time without balancing my PH level and you know why ? Well maybe because I added some organic nutrients in my medium and I did not bother to re-adjusted my PH because it was at 7.0 from the tap. Did it affected my grow ? I don't believe so. Was it successful ? I say almost cuz there is always room for improvements and experimentations.

[crucialbunny]

I've been growing my own soil for a number of years. It started with making a worm compost bin and then studying up on the various natural amendments that not only add nutrients to soil but also feed the microorganisms as well. It's such a pleasure not having to chase PH constantly and just enjoy growing. I do however still check PH periodically to make sure things are staying copasetic in my containers. This coming year I'm changing things up a bit by moving to 25 gallon fabric containers instead of the 5 gallon buckets I've used in the past. With that in mind I have added another 50 gallon bin to mix and mature my soil in. I have also begun making a very benign living soil for solo cup seedlings and rooting clones that isn't overly nutrient rich but supports rapid root growth with plenty of kelp powder and Azomite. In my experience I have found it beneficial to leave plenty of room in my containers for top dressing with fresh P&K enriched soil for flowering. Sometimes I think I put as much, if not more effort into soil development than I do growing.

[crucialbunny]

I have red wigglers and you are right that they don't tolerate heat very well. I have mine out on the balcony where my grow is and I keep them shaded under the potting table. Here in in So. Cal. I get a some scorching days and have had to resort to frozen water bottles on the surface inside the bin on occasion but have dropped the ball more than once and lost entire colonies. I have some friends who keep them in the garage and it works well for them. I have 2 flights of stairs from my garage to my grow area so I battle on keeping them on the balcony. One of the things about most commercially available worm castings is that they don't have viable bacteria any longer. But, if you mix it in with good quality compost material it again becomes very alive. That then combined with recycled potting soil in a 50 gallon trash can for a couple months seems to recondition soil nicely.

[TOKABIGONE]

Aha so commercial castings no longer have viable bacteria and other microbial life. What about products like Recharge to sew a fresh crop? That's what I used with good result. I'm very sure there was life in one or the other because I had very happy plants from day 1. I like the castings for the tilth it adds to coir and the
water holding abilities. 40% coir, 30% perlite, 30% castings made a wonderful light mix that was loose yet held just the right amount of plain water for a gallon every two days. Wet or dry I could stick my flat hand clear to the bottom without disturbing the soil. It would just fall back in when i pulled out. Didn't do that with a plant in it but you get the idea. Nicest tilth soil I ever felt!

[crucialbunny]

I don't add any coir but I use as my base a compost product called Eco Scraps that has some coir in it. It's available at Target for a reasonable price and is primarily vegetable compost. I remember reading reviews of the product before I tried it and the only complaint people seemed to have was that mushrooms grew in it. That's when I knew I wanted to try it. It has worked well for me.

[Cali]

crucialbunny being here in southern Cali and having a worm bin when is hot is hard but I managed quite well this past summer by #1 keep it in the shade #2 and I believe this will save you the water bottle hassle and save your worms from such horrible death. Anyways what I do is I keep the cup holder cardboard trays from fast food restaurants and place them on top of my bin (inside) directly on top of worms, then I dump ice on top that keeps the bin cool moist and doesn’t hurt the worms as the ice slowly melts over the trays. Game changer for me. Learned that from another guy that does composting in large scale here in Cali.

[crucialbunny]

Good idea. Thanks for the tip.

[Cali]

TOKABIGONE i started growing in “living soil” in 2019 haven’t checked ph once ever since. Been curious but I threw away all my ph up,down, and side lol j/k. Most growers on this forum are not interested in growing organic it seems like to me? Or maybe it’s fear of trying a new way of growing? Maybe it’s just they follow GWE tutorials and there really isn’t much on organic it’s mostly bottled chems. Sorry I’m rambling but yeah it’s definitely not a fantasy the mycelium network takes care of that for the plant.

[TOKABIGONE]

Well Hey Cali, thanks for your comment and I couldn't agree more. A lot tho have done little to no plant growing so they rely on others to show them how and the prevailing wisdom is you
must use chemicals and adjust pH to grow pot so they do it without question. It's expedient, it works to
some degree as the entire grow culture has been taught this. Especially the younger crowd. Raised in an apartment and never touched dirt in their lives. I'm not putting anyone down. That's what life has become for most. I grew up touching dirt and hoeing weeds. My parents taught me how to garden. My dad was a small farmer. For me growing is second nature so I was a little dismayed at what I found when I started indoor. Not everyone is so fortunate so it is incumbent on the few who know to show the way. If they don't listen then it's their loss. It's like a cry in the wilderness, lmao! Now I,m rambling but if I can show just a few the benefits of natural growing I'll be successful. The agricorps will take the rest so I'll just keep doing what works for me, just like everyone does. As someone said I don't grow plants I grow soil and the plants love it! Thanks for listening!

[Bengfan]

I quit chasing ph a couple of years ago and my plants have never been happier. I use FFOF as a base, r/o water and Jacks 12-4-16 from start to finish.

[UndergroundFarmer]

I'll hafta go back and check out the recipe. I've been moving in that direction all year after hydro became a rolling disaster for me this summer. Trying to adjust the pH of the water I'm using screwed up my attempt at growing like Mr. C. It seems that aerating the water for 24 hours or so brings my tap water to a not-too-bad 8.0 from 9.0 straight from the faucet, so I'm keeping that. I've got his method mostly working for me otherwise. I can at least get my sprouts through their first three weeks in a cell pot his way and I can't wait to see what happens in veg when I don't screw it all up with pH adjusters.

[TOKABIGONE]

I hear ya UndergroundFarmer If there was one thing that would make me stop growing it would be chasing pH. I figured out that myciia are your very best friend and your roots as well! Amazing critters! They can grow their cilia for several miles and research shows they can communicate over long distances. They're like the Ma Bell of the microbial world! I see you add Mycorrhizae. They form colonies on roots where the eat the raw organic and mineral material and their poop is a readily available plant food...processed I guess lmao. Since roots don't have to mine and process themselves they save a lot of energy and don't have to depend on pH needed for the processing. I will never check or adjust again!

[Gingerbeard]

How about products like super soil concentrate? Must be just for weed because they have one for photoperiod and one for autoflower. I've just gone coco but have space to try something like this.

[Gingerbeard]

Or this?
The one review says, 'As described.' or some such.

[TOKABIGONE]

Yup that's basically the stuff needed. The concept is to start and maintain the fungi and bacteria needed to make a soil with many colonies of them which are happily making organics and minerals available in a form the roots can use without spending the energy to convert on their own. I certainly am not claiming to have invented this, it just took some digging to ferret out how it works and I thought it important to share for those of us frustrated with chasing pH. My autos really thrived this way and next I find how well photos react with this. I expect pretty much the same. It has been happening naturally for millions of years. Look at my just harvested buds. What more do you want? Now I just refine it to work best for me. Thanks for asking Gingerbeard !

[Cloud]

I've been doing organic soil for a few years now and happier than ever. Started out hydro and coco with nutes but never liked the taste of the flower. Burned my mouth and throat. Oh and not chasing ph is always fun.

[TOKABIGONE]

Yes it sure is a lot more fun than constant checking and adjusting with even more chemicals which cause the burning and odd tastes. Mother Nature got it right, who am I to disagree, Cloud ?

[TOKABIGONE]

After reading the replies and a bit of reflection I think that just as important as establishing colonies is finding just the right balance of organics and minerals to add so the microbial excretions (crap) is in the exact balance the plants need for immediate use. It took Mother a few million years to get it right and I know She is still experimenting lmao! It's all out there, it is incumbent on us to discover it! Have a great day pharming!

[golfnrl]

TOKABIGONE I may be a little confused. Are you saying you have made your own super soil recipe or that are using a store bought soil that you're adding amendments to? I looked at the SS recipe on the GWE site. Is that what you use? I totally like the idea of growing in soil for the same 'millions' of reasons that you do. I'm starting my first auto grow with FFOF soil amended with Bio Tabs organic. I'll be growing in the autopot system. That's the auto tent. Getting ready to drop some beans for the photo tent. Will be growing in coco there, also in the autopot system.

[TOKABIGONE]

Good Morning golfnrl I'm amending with a twist I guess. I started researching how to grow without checking and adjusting pH because there are a myriad of things that change it which is where the expression 'chasing pH' originated I believe. It almost made me give up! I never blew anything
up but never excelled in chemistry! I believe the term 'organic' is way overused and has become a marketing ploy. I prefer 'Natural'. All that aside, I wanted to grow in coir w/perlite as a base so I found ME Coco Loco which has all the same basics but in small amounts for a couple weeks so I added more of all of it most especially perlite and worm castings. Proportions are above. Use a microbe seed mix like Recharge or others. Had to use a little math to figure amounts to add for 25 gallons and erred on the light side cuz planned to top dress with cast teas and fish emulsion plus unsulfered molasses which feeds the colonies. I will reconstitute and use the same batch in perpetuity hopefully. Happy Pharming!

Edit: Check the article on building soil on Dark Heart Nursery site. Best basic breakdown i've read

[Cali]

For anyone interested. Just look up Clackamas Coot soil mix it’s so easy and it’s what I use. Had 20 gallon pots at first didn’t have to do anything for a whole year except water. The mix works and he explains it. On YouTube look up his interviews with Tad Hussey from kiss organics. Just YouTube Clackamas Coot and now he is in a lot of podcast when I first started it was just that one in Kissorganics YouTube channel.

[TOKABIGONE]

Thanks Cali That one has been on my check it out list for a bit so I will Tube it. I lived in Clackamas county OR for many years. The river was awesome for float and fish! I'm curious if that's where they are? Sometimes you have to do a cost analysis on some of the better mixes vs from scratch for the same recipe. Listening to the experienced doesn't hurt either!

[crucialbunny]

Should we crack open a can of worms and discuss "flushing" before harvest for living soil growers? I had assumed for a long while that it was unnecessary in a living soil but have read a lot of conflicting information on the subject. Most bottled nutrients use salts as a binding agent so I can readily understand the need for prolonged flushing prior to chop but why would I for organic? The information I have read about the need seems rather ambiguous when I try to understand it but some natural growers seem to think it's important.

[TOKABIGONE]

I can see no logical reason why unless they've supplemented or amended with something they won't smoke. I'll put on hold until further study. Sorry not my can but I'll take the worms if you don't want them

[Going2fast]

TOKABIGONE may I ask how much the soil and amendments cost for your auto grow?

[TOKABIGONE]

Just over a hundred bucks cuz I already had everything else just as you probably do. Certainly far less than up/down, grow this, grow that. A bag of coco loco and a few dry amendments for 30 gallons. Water and cast tea. Boxed up my testers and chemicals and never looked back!