Problem

[PaganRich]

Greetings all and hoping you and yours are all tickety boo
It`s my fault really, my heart wasn`t in a second grow, still isn`t, just can`t get motivated for this one but had some excess seeds and with the lockdown over here being brutal, decided to kill some time...big mistake-literally.
There are 6 strains...Peyote Critical, Purple Punch, Liberty Haze, Royal Gorilla, Gorilla Breath and Gorilla Zkittlez....apart from Purple Punch I have grown these before and my last grow had most of these in there with nought in the way of issues. In fact, this is the first time I`ve really encountered this issue and it is an issue, not strain as before they have behaved themselves. Firstly, I don`t grow tall plants, I prefer to grow short to medium....Set up is passive air intake, 6" extractor plus scrubber, 1200 Viparspectra in a 120x120 tent and a moving fan....air flow is great, passive air coming in at floor height with a bit coming in higher up and good air movement / circulation. Soil based organic grow and watering spot on...so what`s the problem...excessive stretch in veg/ flowering and rampant almost steroid like leaf growth.....When I started I was iffy and they weren`t LST`d to my usual standards and got a bit stretchy from indifference at start...got on top of that but leaf growth became nuts...this is organic so no chemicals involved and this level of leaf development and rapid plant growth to the extent meant that I screwed up by not defoliating in veg which, in hindsight, I should`ve...this produced stretched stems fighting with a leafy canopy for light...realising this I defoliated and then flipped however in the 2 weeks since flipping I`ve had to defoliate 3 times as it`s just gone nuts and the canopy fills up within days with more big fan leaves stretching far from the stems...the lights are at minimal distance before they hit light burn but the stretch is continuing and I`m beginning to run out of height.....so, here are my questions
1-Is this all down to my lack of defoliating in veg and they are just into that grove now or
2-8 x 20l pots is too much in there
Also, my lights are coming up to the height of the scrubber and there is a 5 inch gap between the side heat exhaust grills and the scrubbers sheath...without being paranoid but sounding like it, is this a potential fire risk? (Last pic)
Any thoughts/ help would be mightily appreciated and pictures attached to show the stretch....saying that the girls are in excellent health, no nute burn, little bit of light burn here and there but they look and smell delightful
Thanks folks for reading this and any thoughts/ input....stay mellow

[SoOrbudgal]

Goodmorning Pagan me thinks it's a tad crowded and are jocking for the light. Peace and good weather to you

[Canuck147]

Really - it is a problem a lot of growers wish they had - maybe chop off a few branches - not just the leaves. Or if you have room - start bending some branches.
A good learning lesson for us all.

[PaganRich]

SoOrbudgal Yeah, I was wondering but then you see those pics of scrog net grows and they `re okay but I`m thinking along those lines...bit like trees in a crowded forest kinda thing...gonna do 6 in there next time to increase background light and greater airflow plus more hands on defol (light) next grow but thanks Orb, it helps to see I`m not miles off the beaten path thinking wise... Canuck147 Thank you mate for your compliment and advice but I`ve already inadvertently ripped off three branches and seriously damaged a real main one as well....subconscious destruction I figured...so I`m a tad worried about that....Guys, what`s your thoughts about the LED near the scrubber and heat risk? Thanks both of you...really appreciated from my side

[TOKABIGONE]

Yes PaganRich , you have created a jungle of no return and no where to go! When you say 120x120 space are you talking centimeters? I first thought 10 ft x 10 ft until I saw the pics. Early LST would have been good but now where would you bend them to? Any possibility of moving half to another tent and light and then do some LST or super cropping? Sacrifice half? A shame with such healthy plants. You may have screwed the pooch on this one! Could you rig some kind of heat shield between the light and filter? I wish I had something better to offer but I think your options are limited. If they continue to grow into the lights you might lose the whole thing but your safety is more important. Good luck, I hope you get something out of them.

[PaganRich]

TOKABIGONE No options mate re another tent mate as I`ve downsized after a visit from the Law (for smoking not growing so they didn`t come in-phew)...120cm by 120 cm...usually it`s fine but for some reason, just gone ballistic but I`m with you the whole way in thinking mate and thank you very much for taking the effort in replying...tis frustrating because they don`t even have nute burn tips they are so healthy...stay mellow mate and good call

[MagicMike66]

Possible other reason for them stretching so much could be the distance of your lights as you have quite large node spacing on all the plants.

[PaganRich]

MagicMike66 Prob with the Vipar 1200`s is closer than guidance and man they bleach the leaves...but my thinking was that due to so many leaves, no light was getting through but since I`ve defoliated...3 times heavily in just over a week...they are still stretching but I`m in the natural flowering stretch now so I`m thinking that there`s nought I can do but man, lights are at correct if closer distance and they`ve been thinned but you`re right...like bloody motorways between the nodes...totally baffling but I agree, I think it`s to do with light....thank you MagicMike, it`s re-assuring to hear your thoughts...definitely narrowing it down a tad...stay mellow my friend and again thanks

[MagicMike66]

No worries man, it could also just be genetics they’re spaced that way. Hopefully they fill up with some nice fat buds for you. I use an old fashioned hps, those fancy led’s are too rich for me lol. Maybe if it ever gets legalised over here, I’ll treat myself to one

[Obi-Wan]

PaganRich sometimes they’re just gonna do what they want to do. Training and defoliation in Veg can help control stretch in flowering but your girls just seem to have wanted to reach for the sky. I wouldn’t worry about the fire risk your situation is stable on the low risk side. If you’re feeling particularly aggressive you could pinch the stems and lay them down at about 6” below your lights minimum height. They look strong and they’ll take the stress based on what you’ve detailed above, you’re not growing a room full of princesses, you’ve got a room full of strong ladies.

[PaganRich]

Obi-Wan Thank you mate, they seem to be morphing into Russian shot-putters at the moment...I think they are just, just stopping...fingers crossed but the budlets are looking big on the top so it`s a salvageable if not a bountiful outcome...thank you mate and best wishes to you as well

[gbauto]

A couple of observations...
One of the challenges you're going to face is a result of your light.
That fixture is about 500 watts of relatively inefficient diodes.
It's not capable of supplying enough ppf output to achieve sufficient light levels across that 4x4.
Intense, single-point light sources(like a hid hood) are challenging to achieve even distribution across the canopy, so multiple fixtures would help with that.
The second is what you're already realizing-too many plants.
Unless you're attempting a SOG with SMALL plants, I find that even when I give each plant a 2x2 footprint it'll get crowded.

[PaganRich]

gbauto Thank you mate...yeap, I totally agree...when I had water/ high calcium issues I grew a lot to off-set losses from under performing plants...rectified that and this is a result so bizarrely it is a positive sign of success insofar as correcting faults as shown how girls will now respond. Totally agree about the lights as well as the coverage and that`s why I think I`ll stick to growing less, purer indica strains which will hopefully maximise what power output there is....this season has been my first LED run and I`m still getting a feel for LED`s but I totally am in agreement with you. Thank you mate, really helped my thinking and planning and I wish you all the very best as well and I think in a year or 2 on I will seriously upgrade from these lights. Any suggestions?