Need Help picking lights for stealthy automated grow room (Now with 3D modeling!)

[nibs210]

So, like the title, says, i'm putting together a stealthy, compact, 99% automated grow operation inside a little old busted minifridge that i gutted. I've been doing TONS of research on this site and it's been incredibly helpful! But i'm stuck on trying to figure out what lights will work best for my little operation.

Like the title ALSO says, i may have a bit too much time on my hands thanks to lockdown, and ended up making an exact scale model of the fridge in Rhino 5...


I also put together an Imgur album with more detailed pictures HERE.
So, thanks to this page detailing all the different grow lights and their pros/cons, i've narrowed the choice down to either LEDs, or Flourescents. I REALLY want to use LEDs because they're the best for yield in such a small grow area, are easier to splice into and automate with the Raspberry Pi 3 board that will be doing a lot of the daily tending for me, and I also have plans to possibly water cool them for added efficiency.

But, the problem with LEDs is light burn. and as you can see from my model, vertical space is in short supply, which is why i'm considering (but hoping not to have to use) flourescents.


So, down to numbers. I do plan on cutting a hole in the top of the fridge and adding an enclosed box on top for the light enclosure. the absolute HIGHEST this box can be is 8 inches. i'd like it to be less if possible (top hats don't exactly make for good stealth attire, even for minifridges full of weed):


Now, the inside of the fridge, if it's hard to see in the pictures, is a sideways L shape. the back half of the fridge is taken up by a shelf that's there to make room in the back for all the fridge's mechanical parts (now ripped out and soon to be replaced with the air pump, electronics, and other equipment) so we're stuck with the shape as it is. Here's a handy little diagram with the measurements for the interior volume:


Like that little note says, the plan is to have the lower front area be taken up by the plant pots (still deciding between hydroponic or just normal soil), then a few inches of growing room before we hit the ScroG grid, which will take up the entire footprint of the fridge interior, and be about an inch above that back shelf area so i can train/top the branches back there to get the highest possible yield. However, this leaves VERY little space between the buds and the light (minimum of 7.9 inches, maximum of 17.1 inches, and that's without factoring in the thickness of the light box itself), which if i'm using the LEDs that i want to use, is a recipe for some nasty light burn. I'm brand new to the growing scene, but based on my experience with electronics, would i just be able to install the LEDs really close, then turn the power down until the plants are getting the same amount of light that they'd be getting if the LEDs were 4 feet away at full power? I feel like that would work, but at the same time that solution seems too good to be true. Feel free to let me know if i'm right or wrong with this assumption.

So that's what i need help figuring out. Hit me with whatever brands/models of LED lights that are around 15" x 15", and will work best in this cramped little grow operation i'm planning.

[9fingerleafs]

alltatup Let’s say you’re making lemonade. You are spending too much on the squeezer for the juice you gonna get. There is just too little space to get the environment you need in my opinion. Other members have had problems with automated growing boxes, I think alltatup has a couple and can give you experienced based advice

[alltatup]

9fingerleafs This is funny: it reminds me of the thing you translated about, what was it, micro-grows, and how to clone really small plants...???

[alltatup]

nibs210 I have to agree with 9fingerleafs on this: the box is too small for you to produce more than a few grams, and it won't be top shelf bud because you can't allow your plants to get to where they need to in the vegetation phase. UNLESS you stick with a really short autoflower, you won't get hardly any yield from that box.

I now have 2 BCNL RoomMate grow boxes, but when I only had one, I flushed $1000 down the toilet on a small piece of shit grow box.

[nibs210]

alltatup Let’s say you’re making lemonade. You are spending too much on the squeezer for the juice you gonna get. There is just too little space to get the environment you need in my opinion. Other members have had problems with automated growing boxes, I think alltatup has a couple and can give you experienced based advice

Lol i can definitely see that analogy applying here. But i'm living in a college dorm and wanted to see if i could overengineer a "hiding in plain sight" grow operation that could be shoved under a bed or desk and monitored from my laptop. I'm also half broke and got nothing but time on my hands thanks to lockdown, so having a super complex building project that will, hopefully, result in some weed at some point seems like the perfect way to occupy my time.

[nibs210]

nibs210 I have to agree with 9fingerleafs on this: the box is too small for you to produce more than a few grams, and it won't be top shelf bud because you can't allow your plants to get to where they need to in the vegetation phase. UNLESS you stick with a really short autoflower, you won't get hardly any yield from that box.

I now have 2 BCNL RoomMate grow boxes, but when I only had one, I flushed $1000 down the toilet on a small piece of shit grow box.

Well shit.. not exactly the answer i was looking for, but thanks for the heads up. Those BCNL RoomMate boxes look dope as hell, but are WAY outside of my price range and will probably get me caught by my university lmao. I'm actually okay with low yield (and fucking up while learning) since the automation i plan on doing will mean my hands-on time spent tending to the plants will be relatively low, and everything from water Ph to temp/gas content/moisture levels of the air inside can be monitored and changed from my laptop.

So, lets say i'm dumb enough to attempt this build with this shitbox fridge, and have that 8 inch box bolted onto it for extra room. what LEDs would you reccommend? am i right about just turning the power down to make up for lost vertical distance? if i'm wrong, can i still use LEDs?

[alltatup]

I love the LED Cobs I have. I had HID initially, but I LOVE the LEDs. Here's some advice on what you should consider: https://www.growweedeasy.com/led-grow-lights

My lights were designed for my grow boxes, so I didn't have to do any research on them. I do know that there are good and shitty LEDs, so best to do the research.

Figure out how much taller you can make it, and look into autoflowers that stay within your height limit. You will learn a lot by building this and putting it together, and experience is always a good thing in terms of Cannabis growing.

So you have all my support, nibs: go on ahead, dream that impossible dream and grow that good bud!!!

[nibs210]

Thanks for the advice, i'm definitely adjusting my plans to give the LEDs as much room as i can. I'll be sure to post here if/when i get the project completed!

[9fingerleafs]

i think you can add more room from the bottom, if you use a dwc reservoir underneath and cut off small wholes in the bottom so the plant grows inside the fridge but the roots in a small container below?? like the space you rendered above for the lights just below for the roots

[Toker1]

Try solid works. Can simulate loads and heat flux. Fun!
I would recommend CFL, because that’s all you will have room for in that small space.
I used auto cad to design my 10x10 room in my garage. My buddy was like no way it will fit... I said let’s bet on it. I won, cleared my garage door opener by 3 inches. Tight, but fit like a glove.

[Gingerbeard]

Well hold on a second, folks. Let's consider the following link that was posted in this month's 'New Pages and Updates' on the GWE website.
https://www.growweedeasy.com/how-to-...in-tiny-spaces

And I'd also like to remind everyone of this.

https://spacebuckets.com/

I'm thinking t5's and shorter than normal pots. Your small plants won't need much for a root ball. This is a good, but long, thread about growing in solo cups. Little tiny pots. Saves tons of vertical height.
https://forum.growweedeasy.com/forum...-grow-off-2020

[vostok]

So, like the title, says, i'm putting together a stealthy, compact, 99% automated grow operation inside a little old busted minifridge that i gutted. I've been doing TONS of research on this site and it's been incredibly helpful! But i'm stuck on trying to figure out what lights will work best for my little operation.

Like the title ALSO says, i may have a bit too much time on my hands thanks to lockdown, and ended up making an exact scale model of the fridge in Rhino 5...


I also put together an Imgur album with more detailed pictures HERE.
So, thanks to this page detailing all the different grow lights and their pros/cons, i've narrowed the choice down to either LEDs, or Flourescents. I REALLY want to use LEDs because they're the best for yield in such a small grow area, are easier to splice into and automate with the Raspberry Pi 3 board that will be doing a lot of the daily tending for me, and I also have plans to possibly water cool them for added efficiency.

But, the problem with LEDs is light burn. and as you can see from my model, vertical space is in short supply, which is why i'm considering (but hoping not to have to use) flourescents.


So, down to numbers. I do plan on cutting a hole in the top of the fridge and adding an enclosed box on top for the light enclosure. the absolute HIGHEST this box can be is 8 inches. i'd like it to be less if possible (top hats don't exactly make for good stealth attire, even for minifridges full of weed):


Now, the inside of the fridge, if it's hard to see in the pictures, is a sideways L shape. the back half of the fridge is taken up by a shelf that's there to make room in the back for all the fridge's mechanical parts (now ripped out and soon to be replaced with the air pump, electronics, and other equipment) so we're stuck with the shape as it is. Here's a handy little diagram with the measurements for the interior volume:


Like that little note says, the plan is to have the lower front area be taken up by the plant pots (still deciding between hydroponic or just normal soil), then a few inches of growing room before we hit the ScroG grid, which will take up the entire footprint of the fridge interior, and be about an inch above that back shelf area so i can train/top the branches back there to get the highest possible yield. However, this leaves VERY little space between the buds and the light (minimum of 7.9 inches, maximum of 17.1 inches, and that's without factoring in the thickness of the light box itself), which if i'm using the LEDs that i want to use, is a recipe for some nasty light burn. I'm brand new to the growing scene, but based on my experience with electronics, would i just be able to install the LEDs really close, then turn the power down until the plants are getting the same amount of light that they'd be getting if the LEDs were 4 feet away at full power? I feel like that would work, but at the same time that solution seems too good to be true. Feel free to let me know if i'm right or wrong with this assumption.

So that's what i need help figuring out. Hit me with whatever brands/models of LED lights that are around 15" x 15", and will work best in this cramped little grow operation i'm planning.

IMO Google PC Grows those guys got kamakazi growing down to a fine art, plants and blunts so small not a dwarf would get a hit

[Tersky]

Having started in a 2 ft grow box i am of the firm belief that there is no point to micro grows. Unless you are a seasoned and experienced grower very familiar with plant training then you will end up spending more money to make the grow box than you will ever get in return. In a space that small there is no room for the plant to grow and plants can double or triple in height when flowering. Also keep in mind you have to have your lights a certain distance above the top of the canopy. It can be done but without extensive experience and the right sized enclosure I'm afraid you will be disappointed.

My opinion, a lot of work for hardly any reward.

[RagWeedDWC]

"compact, 99% automated grow operation"

From personal experience, this will be difficult and exspensive. I based this on a DWC type grow, in a closet size space, but I do not see how growing in a medium would make it easier.

The guys in the Red Solo cup knocked it out of the park with contained grows. So however they are feeding and taking care should be similiar (Light Distance, feed, etc). would need to automate that process. I currently do a top off system and preload what I think will work. measuring ph, ppm then dosing what is needed automatically would be costing me fishing lures.

[stump]

if your in a dorm then smell has to also be a concern. How ya gonna filter it?

[stump]

lol i suppose. the smell of weed growing is a totaly different smell than burning a doobie.

[Gingerbeard]

Abso-freaking-lutely stump. Smoking weed smells like burning stuff and a little bit of weed. Flowering weed smells like weed flowers. Thick, stick in your nose, feel going down the back of your throat, weed flower loveliness.
I must dab...

[stump]

no doubt

[nibs210]

Wow! i didn't know stoner forums were still THIS alive and well! i've had a blast looking through the replies and following the resources linked!

as for my light problem, i actually managed to figure out the perfect solution! i found this handy guide on LED wattage (labeled as HID equivalent wattage) to optimal distance from the plants:

As you can see, 200 watts and lower is right in that sweet spot for this microgrow operation i'm putting together! with that info, i did more amazon digging and found the PERFECT 180 watt grow light for my fridge!

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00G1WJ4CG/ref=crt_ewc_title_dp_3?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A2WKQ23WU3PLDV

now, to respond to some poeple:

Well hold on a second, folks. Let's consider the following link that was posted in this month's 'New Pages and Updates' on the GWE website.
https://www.growweedeasy.com/how-to-...in-tiny-spaces

And I'd also like to remind everyone of this.

https://spacebuckets.com/

I'm thinking t5's and shorter than normal pots. Your small plants won't need much for a root ball. This is a good, but long, thread about growing in solo cups. Little tiny pots. Saves tons of vertical height.
https://forum.growweedeasy.com/forum...-grow-off-2020

Thanks for the resources! these were all super interesting rabbit holes to go down in terms of growing. and thanks for shouting out spacebuckets! i've been lurking through there like crazy since i'm basically making a space fridge.

Having started in a 2 ft grow box i am of the firm belief that there is no point to micro grows. Unless you are a seasoned and experienced grower very familiar with plant training then you will end up spending more money to make the grow box than you will ever get in return. In a space that small there is no room for the plant to grow and plants can double or triple in height when flowering. Also keep in mind you have to have your lights a certain distance above the top of the canopy. It can be done but without extensive experience and the right sized enclosure I'm afraid you will be disappointed.

My opinion, a lot of work for hardly any reward.

i was worried about that, but like i said to Gingerbeard, the pictures and videos i'm seeing on /r/spacebuckets says otherwise. perfect example:

https://imgur.com/eA5SwOJ

"compact, 99% automated grow operation"

From personal experience, this will be difficult and exspensive. I based this on a DWC type grow, in a closet size space, but I do not see how growing in a medium would make it easier.

The guys in the Red Solo cup knocked it out of the park with contained grows. So however they are feeding and taking care should be similiar (Light Distance, feed, etc). would need to automate that process. I currently do a top off system and preload what I think will work. measuring ph, ppm then dosing what is needed automatically would be costing me fishing lures.

I agree, it will be difficult and very expensive at first. once i have the system up and running, and have used the first grow to work out the kinks, the time and money needed to keep it running plummets almost immediately. thanks to arduino and Raspberry Pi, i can add sensors to detect, report, and automate every single aspect of a grow environment. i've actually switched plans to a bubbleponics DWC setup instead of soil medium just to help control and automate it even more.

if your in a dorm then smell has to also be a concern. How ya gonna filter it?

Well, first of all, like Gingerbeard said, it's not exactly an earth shattering surprise to smell weed coming from a dorm room. And for my room specifically, which is one bedroom in a suite of 5, the RAs are going to need to fight their way through clouds of smoke, and try their hardest not to trip over the bongs and blunt wraps of my other 6 roommates before they even get to my door, so i think i'm pretty safe.

But, to answer your question, i'm installing a carbon filter in the grow box that hooks up to the inline exhaust fan:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07B3RNW35/ref=crt_ewc_title_dp_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A2PQGFJXAT8J9K

[RagWeedDWC]

Well, I will follow you closely, was experimenting with both water top off and ph control. I built from scratch a water top off, but replaced it with a aquarium system. Worked perfect once I found a sensor that would operate with all the bubbles and nutrients.
Was planning on doing something like this for next year.

https://create.arduino.cc/projecthub/atlas-scientific/diy-ph-dosing-pump-061cef?ref=tag&ref_id=hydroponics&offset=7

But my grow is considerable larger than your plan and most of the monitoring and required nutrients and PH dosing will be mounted outside the box (Hidden but outside).

[RagWeedDWC]

I will take back my comment about the difficulty of the automation side of things. Following up your earlier comment concerning the arduo, I purchased a mega 2560 Kit and played. With the correct probes I believe you could come up with ph doser and very probably a nutrient load. Pretty cool little devices, and you can teach an old dog a new trick.

[Gjourney101]

We are all thrilled to grow aome good bud. And yes, it is fun to get crafty! But, none of us here want you getting trouble and ruining your educational opportunities. If you're in a dorm, you'll be facing more trouble than just growing if you get caught. I wouldn't recommend growing on a campus, especially for a grow that would yield a few blunts. Don't risk the biscuit my friend. Grow safely and securely.