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Getting Somewhere (Taking the main line)

Starris

Starris

New member
Hey all. I thought that I should maybe stop making a new post every time one of the plants scrapes its knee, so I'm just gonna put all my updates in here. After getting the humidifier in (and watering the adjacent soil properly), my plants really bounced back! the clawing lessened, and the growth sped up again.

Here they are 1 1/2 days ago
http://i.imgur.com/unsIIqJ.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/921WEIT.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/LZvg8z2.jpg
They actually got a bit of tip burn, but that's just from the roots growing out more into the soil, which is a bit strong, so they'll grow out of it.

Today I decided that they were finally healthy enough to go through with main lining. Overall, the process was painless, and they seem to have taken it like champs.
http://i.imgur.com/D2JYxB8.jpg (Family after their trip to the barber)
http://i.imgur.com/XTfqj0z.jpg (The black jack has had a few struggles, which I'll admit were caused by me, but she seems to have righted herself)
http://i.imgur.com/EcGh70r.jpg (my cough champion, think she'll respond well)
http://i.imgur.com/48eETEF.jpg (I actually kept the lower growth on this one as a bit of a precaution, in case something happens and the others are too weak to bounce back)
http://i.imgur.com/9Xm4mj0.jpg (trimmings, they smell delicious c:)

Although, like most things, it wasn't completely free of mistakes. while bending my first one, I didn't take care of the shoulders and actually tore it a bit.
(the damaged one is on the right)
http://i.imgur.com/UNjzfd5.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/zRUMDis.jpg

Instead of tying it down with the softies, I put one in between it and the fan base, to actually lift it up and hold it in a more natural position, I guess like a sling. I'm hoping that this will help, but should I do more? I've heard of using electrical tape, though that may be an awkward place to put it, and I don't want to do more damage fumbling around.
 
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http://i.imgur.com/B3l2GwI.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/h8IUl9r.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/jky06n3.jpg

Well, this happened. I made a bit of a dumb mistake. I decided to take the lights off of the 24 hour schedule, to save some dosh, and maybe give the plants a less stressful time getting back to normal after mainlining. I fed them the day before with half strength go box nutes, some maxi liquid seaweed, and recharge. The problem is I never put my humidifier on a timer as well, so when the light/exhaust fan turned off, the humidifier stayed on, and was unable to exhaust properly. I came home to 99% RH! Luckily, there doesn't appear to be any mold, but I found these spots that look like deficiencies. I'm thinking that perhaps being at 99% made it so that the plants didn't drink any water at the roots, so they didn't get any nutrients. It was off like that for about 4 hours. Is that drastic an effect possible in that time? I feel like I've caused a few very strange problems along this grow, haha.
 
From looking at the pics, they look like they'll be just fine. It's normal to run into small issues along the way, but when you're on top of it like you have been the plants will barely even notice!
 
The plants will show you every time you make a mistake and they keep the evidence so you won't do it again. I love these plants
 
Thanks for the words of encouragement. Jeeze I feel like I have to make a new post every day. Things are going alright, except I messed up more when trying to adjust some ties. Ended up breaking the other arm on the cough, and damaging the blackjack (less severely). Instantly took the ties off the black jack to prevent any more stress, and after a couple days, its doing alright.

https://i.imgur.com/1MkY0DV.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/klUjHrXh.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/5DOCFYjh.jpg

The issue now is that it's stiffening up and I don't think I can just lst it down again. Is super cropping an option for this, or would that be too much stress on it right now? I want to maximize my height efficiency, but if it's too much stress, then 3 less inches isnt catastrophic.
 
Maybe you can just start training those two main cola to wrap around bottom edge of pot as new growth appears. One in one direction and one in the other. I don't know.
 
When it's getting too stiff....



If you only bend near the ends the stems are always flexible. It may not look as pretty, but it accomplishes what you want without worrying about breaking!

If it's too stiff, like you said it helps to supercrop a little - take the place you want to bend, and hold that part of the stem tightly in between your fingers. Just gently, gently wiggle it back and forth for 10-15 seconds without putting much pressure at all. You'll notice it "loosening" as the stuff inside slowly gets crushed, but the outside skin stays intact. If you do that and stick to the ends of branches you should be able to bend it quite a bit further without a problem :)
 
Update :
Thanks for the response, Nebula! That really was what I should have done, and I was able to get some more bending in using that safer technique.

A bunch of good news for this one! I've learned first hand that you should NOT run your bulb for less than it's rated. I'd seen this before online, but got greedy for less electricity usage and didn't heed it. I have a 1000 watt mh going, but I've had it at 400-600 previously. I've also previously posted about how my blackjack was getting burned, even though the lumens were very VERY low for the distance. The bulb was so much less efficient that to even have them at the minimum 20000 was a little to close/hot. I learned this when I decided to switch to 1000 just as an experiment, and WOW. The light is so much brighter and more efficient. I can get 40k at the recommended distance now, and I could probably even move it a bit closer. The effect was almost instant. healthy growth abundant and all that jazz.

I ended up super cropping my blackjack a tad, and it's still higher than the others, but it is a bit more manageable. The strawberry that I snapped a bit also healed up and is back on track. I currently have 4 colas on the 3 mainlined plants, and have around 12 main spots on the one cough that was topped at the third and just lst'd.

Here's some pics:
Group
http://i.imgur.com/Yt3hfXB.jpg
Cough #3
http://i.imgur.com/7IqJOfT.jpg
Cough#2 (those arms)
http://i.imgur.com/nw0ndy7.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/yUHBoXC.jpg
Cough#1
http://i.imgur.com/oF6ACHd.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/kRL491x.jpg
Blackjack#1
http://i.imgur.com/ZNoqEox.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/DmddF6h.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Oa2MGaj.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/t52Lrkg.jpg (I know I bought feminized, but woo! It's a girl!)

Overall, I'm very happy with how they're growing, which leads me to a big question. I started this grow fully intent on only keeping two of them for the long run. I didn't wan't to crowd the place, plus a lot of the mainlining tutorials I've read usually have people using two plants. The problem is, looking at them now, I don't want to lose any of them, which makes me wonder if that's actually the best way to do things. From what I see, yields are kind of dependent on (assuming nutes and watering is tuned right) light, roots, and space. I was planning on selecting the two I like the best, and moving them up to 10 gal smart pots for the final home, but would I possibly get more yields if I moved all of them to 10 gals? my space and light would stay the same, but 40 gallons of roots is quite a bit more than 20. It is possible, though, that the light (1000w mh-hps) or the space (48x48x78in with about 36-40in of available height for the plants to grow) would bottleneck the grow and the extra roots aren't needed, or that it could even over crowd and hinder the overall harvest. Perhaps there are some ways to make it work, like only making 4 cola'd mainlines and having 16 total but bigger ones each? It's hard to choose two of the babies to just throw away, but even harder if I don't know what the better idea for the grow even is. If I were to pick two, it would probably be cough#1 and blackjack#1 since they grow similarly.
 
It's never easy to cull a plant. I killed 2 seedlings that cost me over $30 but it was necessary. Most people over germinate because they have experience with popping the bare minimum and having one stunt or stall out weeks into veg. It's what taught me at least...the hard way.

I would stick to your original plan if I were you. If you overcrowd your grow space, you may regret it.

Also, dimming your bulbs causes additional stress on the bulbs components since you're running them out of spec. Also your light spectrum is modified as a result. I always recommend keeping your ballast at 100%.
 
Ahh, there's the answer I was kind of expecting, but not hoping for haha. I'll try and ask around my trusted circle of stoners to see if anyone can take in two healthy plants in need of a home. Also I forgot to mention that part about the light. Not only did it get so much brighter, but the spectrum is so full and warm now c: Thanks for the advice, nugs!
 
It does look quite a bit like a fungus gnat. Are they really tiny and crawling/buzzing around your topsoil? If so it's actually pretty easy to get rid of them. They can't survive if you blow a fan over your soil and always wait until the topsoil is completely dry before you water. If they don't have wet topsoil and stagnant air to buzz around in, they can't breed or survive. You can also use yellow sticky traps to catch them, and there are products you can water your plant with that specifically kill their larvae, but if you just water your plants so the topsoil stays dry and use a fan you may not even need any extra products. I wrote a little bit more about fungus gnats here if you want more pics and info on how to get rid of fungus gnats :)
 
Update: Jeeze, I am doing my best to kill these things. I think I solved the fungus gnat problem. I never saw more than one, but I went on the side of caution and let the plants dry out...a lot. Maybe a little more that necessary even, but I just wanted to make sure. That caused some deficiencies, but I gave them a good feeding afterwards and the perked up, though I did have to take off some full yellowed leaves. I finished the final step of mainlining, and overall, they took it well.

here's a group photo
http://i.imgur.com/qddqavm.jpg

8 colas each, and the two coughs are looking nice, fairly square. I found out that I left soft ties on cough #1 for too long, and it caused some interesting, though not really helpful, coil designs in the stem.
http://i.imgur.com/ERK2hAc.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/qdMLuPE.jpg

Cough #2 continues to take it in stride
http://i.imgur.com/Qs9mm11.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Zyfwu4D.jpg

Cough #3 Is really nice and bushy! I'll admit that my next grow might just be a top and bend run, based on how nice this girl looks, and how much less work and stress it took.
http://i.imgur.com/mZpxQHV.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/eYB00Ga.jpg

Poor Blackjack #1 has suffered the most of my mistakes this run. She kept coming back, but I may have finally done her in. Her arms had grown a tad crooked, so I attempted to bend her more straight, and ended up snapping a stem. I didn't notice and moved on to more work. It was about 5 minutes before I even realized what I'd done, and it was literally holding on by a thread. No picture of that since I taped it up in a frenzy and am hoping for the best.

Right after taping
http://i.imgur.com/EY41Cvj.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/1L1OWDf.jpg
The next day
http://i.imgur.com/0XKrGLg.jpg

Withered and sad looking. I've been trying so hard to make the blackjack viable, since it was actually the strain the made me really serious about growing weed. I've never actually smoked it, but it had all the traits that I would be after in the stuff that I take. Part of my worry is that, even if she manages to pull through, she's inferior to the other two from a height/even shape/quality of stem stem standpoint, so I'm not sure if she'd even be a good choice to keep. I know that one cough is much more sativa than the other, but they're both much more healthy. I guess I'd be curious to know, if given some time, she'd be able to perform and yield comparable amounts to the other two, and whether the more sativa heavy nature of the one cough is that much of an issue with growing with the other. I watered them two days ago, and they're already looking dry, so the transplant time is upon. I need to make a choice, and it's very difficult. each plant has pros/cons. One thing that I'm not sure about is if the smell of a plant in the vegetative stage indicates how much they'll smell as a flower. Like will a smelly vegging plant be more likely to have a great dank smell later on? I've assumed so but I'm not sure if that's actually the case.

Cough #1
Pros: healthy, uniform, more indica
Cons: Not much of a scent

Cough #2
Pros: healthy, uniform, good scent
Cons: more sativa

Blackjack#1
Pros: Great smell, Personal attachment, more indica
Cons, Damaged, less uniform, more wasted height

Any opinions on this? I'm gonna be making the decision tomorrow.
 
If you decide to cut out your black jack....take a few clones and baby them and make a healthy mom out of the best one till you can clone her when you want to grow her again.

Tuff choices..never easy when trying to decide to cut one out...
 
Bigdate:

Okay so this blackjack. THIS BLACKJACK...is so stressful. I've wanted so hard to make it work for my first grow, but it's just so delicate compared to the strawberries. I understand this is my fault really. I just wasn't skilled enough to make it bend without breaking. Pretty much every step of the way had one issue or another.

http://i.imgur.com/7aZdSUI.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/DcgzBrx.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/ZlTYYJj.jpg (after a second attempt at supercropping)

All of this was bad, but I still wanted to go through and keep it to the end, until I broke a stem again. It was one that I tied down, and it was okay at the time, but it broke while I was away for a minute. I immediately wrapped it up, but it was holding on by a thread.
http://i.imgur.com/n2Wd8Pm.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Iz3NXxb.jpg

After a day or two I noticed it wasn't bouncing back, just getting droopier and more dead looking. I realized why when I looked closed, and saw that it was starting to fall out of the tape because it was completely detached. I was left with a mangled, 7 headed main lined plant.

I decided to change it up and make this a strawberry cough run, MAIN LINE VS TOPPING. Main lining has been a good learning experience, and I'm glad I did it, but I'm not sure if I want to do it again. It was a lot for my first run. All the cutting and bending and risk, I just had a much more stressful time doing this than if I had done a more traditional grow. If mainlining can really get the yields I'm after, then it'd be worth doing more and perfecting, but I want to see if I can get similar yields with just the normal stuff. If I can, the smaller margin for error might be worth it. I worked on my other cough than I'd been pretty much neglecting after topping. I started off by just cleaning off small undergrowth that was just wasting energy. I'm a bit worried that maybe I overdid it since it almost looks like lolipopping and I'm still in mid vegetative stage, but it seemed to be okay with it.
http://i.imgur.com/n2PT6Vt.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/v3piemB.jpg

I ended up transplanting the two coughs into 10 gal pots. These will be their final homes.
http://i.imgur.com/BmXWMG8.jpg

The next day I got more soil and decided to move the blackjack up as well. I set to work tying all of their branches into position, and did some defoliation.
http://i.imgur.com/Uj3bdFX.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/iREYQkI.jpg (topped cough#3)
http://i.imgur.com/7r8YkQi.jpg (mainlined cough#1)
http://i.imgur.com/yLXD0XA.jpg (painlined blackjack#1)

I will probably separate the black jack soon and grow it under my fluorescent lights. I do want to clone this plant. It has beautiful leaves and I think it has the potential for purp. This is it after a night I forgot to close a window and temps dropped to 64.
http://i.imgur.com/ACwHqFx.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/vt1GUez.jpg

It also smells amazing. I bit of tang, skunk, and even a touch of mint, all in the vegetative stage! I feel like, in my future self's more experienced hands, this could be a real winner. I'll have to brush up on GWE because I'll admit, cloning was kind of lost on me the first couple times I read through it, but now it's a necessity, so I'll have to learn. As a final question here, could the blackjack's fragility also be caused by me, via a nutrient deficiency? the stems weren't hollow and I saw no spots that would signify a lack of calcium, but perhaps it's something I don't know of currently. As always, comments, critiques, tips, tricks, suggestions, and scoldings are all appreciated and welcome!

edit: I realize that it's not a perfect comparison, since the two coughs are from seed and don't seem to be the same phenotype, but it's more of a general idea thing haha.

With the blackjack, I forgot to mentioned that it almost looks sparkly. Like it has trichomes or something, though I know that's not possible. Does anyone know what that means?
 
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could the blackjack's fragility also be caused by me, via a nutrient deficiency?

I don't think so. Look into adding silica to your nutrient regiment if your want sturdier plants.

With the blackjack, I forgot to mentioned that it almost looks sparkly. Like it has trichomes or something, though I know that's not possible. Does anyone know what that means?

It's probably the resin glands. They can get sticky, even in veg. I think it just means the plant is mature enough to go full bore into flower. Put a magnifier on the sparkly parts if you want to check for sure.
 
All your plants look really good! I saw you mentioned you "painlined" a plant (it was just a small typo) and it made me giggle.

I love the manifold vs topping debate! It's so neat to see you try it both ways! The cool thing about topping is it takes less time in the vegetative stage to get the same number of main colas, because your plant gets bigger, faster. The way you've trained your plant that was topped is great. You've basically got the same thing as a manifold, but you did it in way fewer steps than manifolding so it took less time and that plant is bigger than all the others! Yields depend a lot on strain, but if I had to guess, I'd guess the topped one will end up yielding the most if you switch them to the flowering stage all at the same time because it's likely going to end up being a bigger plant than all the others!

I feel like the thing about manifolding is it takes the thought out of it for some growers, while almost guaranteeing good results if you follow all the steps. Manifolding only takes a few minutes over a few sessions, and then I'm basically done training. With manifolding, you don't have to make any decisions about which stems to keep and which to get rid of, and there's overall less pruning. But if the process of making the manifold feels like a pain, you can definitely get the same results doing just topping and training like you have, and you'll shave a week or two off your grow! The main goal is to get a flat shape with tons of evenly spaced colas, and any way you achieve that will get you similar results as far as yields :)

I definitely wouldn't worry about breaking off any main stems. You have plenty of others to take its place! Your plants look really good and I think they're going to start growing a lot faster now. They're just at that size where they start growing fast enough you can see the difference each day. :)
 
Update:

http://i.imgur.com/2SUCzxch.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/LfwgUXDh.jpg (cough #3)
http://i.imgur.com/n30IvvYh.jpg (cough #1)
​​​​​http://i.imgur.com/e9pTR6Xh.jpg (blackjack #1)

Well o-fricking-kay. I'll take it. thanks to green and nugs for making me less nervous about taking the plunge into defoliation. So much new growth. Probably gonna pick up a trellis net tomorrow since they're reaching the end of the pots. Also a question for nebula in regards to your blackjack/wonder woman grow. You said you let more than just the 8 colas grow and that increased your yields over nugbuckets' original method. Did you keep everything over the lolipop line, or should I (when I get to that point) take down more/is there a good way to tell what will do more harm taking away energy from other colas than the good from growing out?
 
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