General Questions nutrients, thinning out pruning Auto-flower, and light height

[Cab1080]

Hi, I have a small grow area that I am growing my 1st grow in. It is a hydro setup and I am using GH Flora Trio nutrients. 300w Mars Hydro Led. They are starting to flower so I have reduced the nutrients by half and eliminated the Bloom and started giving it powder Kool bloom(2-45-28)instead. How does that sound?
Things seem to be going ok but I am wondering if I should be cutting lower leaves or thinning these out, maybe it too late. Two plants the one on the left is about a a week older and is a Critical Purple Auto and the other is Tangerine Dream Auto. This is my 1st grow so kinda nervous about the pruning aspect of things. Also they are not very tall which could be the strain but I have my light now about 12" away(300watt LED). Wondering if I should move up further to facilitate height growth. Here are some pics I hope help describe my situation. Thanks in advance!

 

[DoctorJohnson]

You don't need anything but GH FloraSeries for a successful grow. You can use GH's recommended schedule at their website, but dilute it by half, or you can use Nebula's here at GWE. (I use Nebula's)
That said, your plans look great! (Shots in blurple light are pretty useless, though. A good shot, closer up, with plenty of white light works best.)
Your box looks overcrowded! You're not going to have good air circulation with a jungle like that! You might want to actually remove a plant. Some defoliation and a fan will help to keep the air circulating and water droplets forming on the leaves.
Plants that are getting plenty of light (like yours) grow shorter and denser. That's a good sign. As long as the top leaves aren't getting cooked, you can keep the lamp close.

 

[Cab1080]

Thanks for the advice! And Picture help! Yeah humidity is going to be a concern along with temps. I can keep box about 80-85 and humidity in my area is going up so now the box is at like 56-60% humidity. I have a small fan I rigged up on one side of box now I need one for other side. It has one intake fan in bottom and two exhaust fans up top of box but they are not real powerful. Any advice on reducing humidity in box? I have heard some say a cup of salt and rice set off in a corner. As you can see, not much room for a lot of equipment int there, lol.

 

[DoctorJohnson]

Remember that when plants get bigger and are really growing, they "transpire" a lot water--that is, they actively take it up from the reservoir and push it out their leaves--so they are in effect working as "humidifiers," like a quart of water per plant per day or more. To deal with that, you need open paths for air (so no jungle) and good air circulation. (My 2'x2' tent as a fan blowing air in, a fan blowing air around, and a fan blowing air out.) Salt or rice ain't gonna do it. They are too slow and can't keep up with healthy plant's transpiration rate.

Some people in warm, humid climates end up rigging dehumidifiers or AC, but I'd suggest (sorry) removing one plant and then some defoliation.

To defoliate, start with any leaves that are damaged, then remove some leaves that are in full shade (and so not really contributing) and blocking air flow. You may be surprised both by how quickly a healthy plant recovers from defoliation (within hours) and how often you have to do it (at peak growth, as often as twice a week).

"Screen of green" growing works well in that regard because you can have a flat, easy-to-light canopy on top and bare stalks down below, which makes air flow easy.

If plucking leaves freaks you out, start with just a few and see how it looks.

There are purists here who say "No defol," but with dense growth in a small box like that, you have no choice or your plant will be dripping.

There are videos on YouTube that are helpful, and of course be sure to read everything here at GWE--awesome site with solid info.

I guess after all that blather I should go check in on my own plant. (I just got a new 60X illuminated loupe from Amazon that I want to try out.)

 

[Cab1080]

Awesome, thanks I will check out some videos and take your suggestion and start with the damaged or dead ones. That won't be as scary. I may start leaving the box door open too to get better air circulation. I have been searching the web for a solar or long lasting battery or rechargeable fan that is flat that produces a good amount of air. And yea I can't stress enough the info I have got from GWE! So much info, I tell everyone to check it out. Give you the tools to start and then really some in depth info for getting more out of your grows!

 

[DoctorJohnson]

You can find equipment cooling fans (like PC fans) at http://www.digikey.com. They are a great company with so much stuff it can be overwhelming, but they have salespeople on the phone who can help.

Small fans that can move a lot of air are noisy. Good fans (i.e. with good bearings) are expensive. You can find cheap basic fans on eBay. Remember that flat equipment cooling fans with sleeve bearings (the cheaper ones) have to be kept vertical or they wear out fast.

Yeah, just leaving the door open can help help a lot!

 

[Cab1080]

It's still a jungle up in here! I have removed what seems to me to be a lot of leaves on two different occasions. Should I go a lot more aggressive?

 

[Campesino]

They are starting to flower so I have reduced the nutrients by half and eliminated the Bloom and started giving it powder Kool bloom(2-45-28)instead. How does that sound?

This doesn't sound good at all!

You maintain consistent nutrient levels, but increase the ratio of Bloom during flowering. You need to follow a nutrient schedule!
This is GH schedule for your nutes: http://gh.growgh.com/docs/Feedcharts/GH_FloraSeries-DTW_03216am.pdf

The amounts in the GH recipes are about 2x higher than you should use, but the ratios for the base nutrients are correct. We are serious about cutting the recipe in half, if you measure EC you will understand why.

Notice how "Gro" is phased out and "Bloom" is increased during flowering.

If you want to play with Koolbloom then you need to be watching EC or PPM. You should watch this anyway, but using boosters without paying attention to EC is a recipe for disaster. EC meters are cheap and an excellent investment in your grow. If you have any EC/PPM questions I'll be happy to help.

 

[DrPhoton]

Agree with Dr J, to have a better idea why crowding and poor air curculation is bad for plant health and performance. Have a look at my article on environment conditions.

 

[Chefbjy]

Yeah was going to say something about that. The dry koolbloom is designed to promote ripening and should be used for the later weeks of flowering. I read on gh website that using liquid koolbloom is a primer for the dry and should use it to help it adjust to such high pk ratios.

 

[Canuck147]

I would thin your jungle out more.

 

[Inuart88]

This is all I will say agin nutrients are based on plants size. Smaller the plant less food it needs bigger the plant more it eats. I go over the recommended ml per gallon on GH drain to waste guide. If a company GH advanced nutrients, etc they would not give you a chart that would kill your plants. If they did who the fuck would buy there shit??? No one because everyone’s plants would die. This 1/4 1/5 1/16 is stupid yes ease in to see how it effects I guess. Anyway end rant.

 

[Inuart88]

Wondering if I should check it an article.

 

[D.A.A.S.69]

Morning 1080, if they were mine. I would definitely take a bunch of more of those big leaves that are blocking bud sites, especially if you are having high humidity problems, even if you ain't having humidity problems, I'd take a bunch more of those middle leaves, like Canuck147 says, you need good air movement going thru that plant.
GoodLuck

 

[Chefbjy]

Yes they give you a recommended feed chart and often it's too strong for cannabis. Pulling this up from gwe guides and articles. I know, I know, you want to do everything you can for your plant.

But the truth is, often marijuana needs nutrients at half strength or LESS of what’s recommended on a regular nutrient schedule for plants like tomatoes.

Basically, as long as your plant does not have any nutrient deficiencies, adding more nutrients is not going to cause the plants to produce more buds.

I do not agree it's based on plant size but what's already in your medium. If you're feeding full strength all the time it builds up salts in the medium that are inhibiting the plant from drinking water....yes it does need water too. This will likely cause lockout and deficiencies. You have to take care of your medium as well as your plants.

 

[Inuart88]

Lets look at it this way if a plant pops from seed does it need 50ml? of rapid start or 1.5ml. If a plant has been vegged for 5 months and is 4 feet high do you still think that 1.5ml of rapid start will be enough nutrients for that plant? Point in case plant size determines plant food. and most of these nutrients have been made for cannabis. Also any nutrient i have used always reccomends doing Ph water every other or everything 3 waterings. This is to flush that salt build up out aka DRAIN TO WASTE. But since the guides the company offers will kill your plants i assume doing this will too.. Back to my point of a company wont sell shit that kills your plants it always comes back to the grower not the comapny.


If the feed chart is to much and peoples CANNABIS plants die or can't take it. Why would they offer that information instead of letting the grower figure it out? If i sold you shit thats going to kill your plants and you keep coming back to buy it.? That would not make any sense

 

[D.A.A.S.69]

Chefbjy, amen brother, like you say depends on plant sizes, but less nutrients is better than more, especially for autoflowers, I've had AdvancedNutrients burn the crap out of healthy plants before, not all but some. Plus the nute companies want you to use more, so you have to buy more.
On plants that I use nutrients on, I always feed until I get a little tip burn, as a guide , and alot of times I get a little burn at half strength.

 

[Inuart88]

when did he say it depends on plant size? "I do not agree it's based on plant size but what's already in your medium"? i know you dont like me but my information is solid and also has research and experiments behind it. I know i said its based on plant size which it is.

 

[Inuart88]

Answer me this i had a plant i vegged for 5 months i gave it 10ml MICRO 10ml Bloom 10ML Grow GH trio PER GALLON 2 gallon watering so 60ml of it total. This plant did not burn at all while my smaller 1 month veg plant burned to the fucking tits?

 

[D.A.A.S.69]

Hey88, I don't have a thing against you, I'm an old ass, hippie, i love everyone.
I would think everyone would know better than to feed young plants, full strength, right off the bat, but maybe not.
If in not mistaken, even Nebula , says to be careful with the amount of nutrients you use.
And again, I'm not mad at anyone, I got over being mad at people, while I was in Vietnam for 18months, in 1970.