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    HELP! How to know when to throw in the towel.

    I wish I had found this forum months ago. Thanks for the 3000K welcome, everybody.

    In October '23 a friend gifted me a tent and two 150 watt LED panels. I decided to learn how to clone--I had no deep dreams or desire to grow to the finish at the time, oddly. I just wanted to propagate. It seemed like the natural first step and a critical skill to have. But what started with a few gelato clones from the dispensary soon turned into a thing all of its own. I hadn't given much thought to where the plants I created would eventually go. This was one of many mistakes I would make. I knew from the start it wouldn't be easy, so I allowed it.

    So... I decided to flower. Like Space-X, I knew my sh1t might explode (in a literal, bad way, not like exploding bud growth) as it sails skyward, but I was prepared to document it and learn why.

    Here we are at 18 days since flip, and I'm beginning to doubt things are going well, or even average. The stretch was insane, and my internode space was garbage to start (3+ inches in veg state plants). Budlets are small to my eyes and stems are flimsy. Adjacent nodes are in different zip codes.

    I'm stressed, and I think the plants are too. I've got too much material and not enough light. And the last week was an environmental nightmare that had to be dealt with. I should have focused on fewer plants with more light, fewer transplants, grown veg under the same LED they will flower under, and flipped when plants were shorter. I should not have flowered the moms I used for cloning, they should have been culled, and used young plants in fresh soil instead. But I couldn't find it in me to destroy something that had provided cuttings so faithfully, despite having several cohorts of clones already rooted and potted up. Now they are tall and leggy and looking generally dissatisfied and frumpy.

    The big question: if you had plenty of stock veg material, would you just start over with fewer smaller plants? If I hold out until harvest, my existing veggies will be well beyond overgrown. I will likely have to use yo-yos too, if the buds decide to plump up.

    The 1st pic is a retired mom (gel#41) 2nd & 3rd are the same clone (gel#33).

    4th pic shows sizes of young veg plants available as immediate replacements. The stick is 26.5 inches tall. I have 3 gal bags with FFOF soil ready to use.

    Sadly, one way or another, some plants are crossing the bridge today. Still working out what my veg stock quota should be... officially my count never ever ever exceeds four 😏

    ​​​​​​​Any experienced advice is greatly appreciated πŸ™‚
    Last edited by 12HourPower; 02-02-2024, 06:15 PM. Reason: Clarified picture captions

    #2
    Never give up. The grow experience you gain is the most valuable thing to have in the beginning. Learn from what you do then build on it for next time. About the only time I would consider putting down a grow is if there were some type of terminal infection like rampant bud rot or infestation that was killing them anyway. Those plants are way to good to just trash them. Any harvest they provide is a bonus to your gained knowledge.
    Don't worry, be happy, grow sticky buds.

    Comment


    • 12HourPower
      12HourPower commented
      Editing a comment
      Thanks for the encouragement. I should clarify: I will never give up! It would only be a setback. I would never scrap everything. But with floor/light space at a premium and replacements on the ready, I was considering using the best of the best. If it were a few months from now, I would happily donate my extras to an outdoor garden.

    #3
    Well have you already taken clones? I'd rather not use flowering cuts takes to long to revert back to veg. Are you going to get another light? Are those true watts from the wall? I mean if you don't think what you got is worth going forward do to all the issues do what's best for you. Gather better equipment if you plan on doing this well. I'm not gonna tell you to chop, it's your call.
    Smoke Ganja create Peace Respect Nature don't trash the Planet

    Soil grower with coco/perlite mixed in
    indoor/outdoor grower
    1 36"x36"x66" tent- Viparspectra P2500
    1 3x3x6 tent- used in late spring for seedlings both veggies & weed. I have 2 viparspectar 450r for that tent.
    I use a t-5 & 54watt CFL for seedlings
    Sometimes i use plastic sometimes i use fabric grow containers
    Currently using fish/guano during veg growth & FF Grow Big 6-4-4 teens to bloom. Once i see pre-flower i switch to
    Age Old Organics Bloom 5-10-5

    Comment


    • 12HourPower
      12HourPower commented
      Editing a comment
      "Well have you already taken clones?"
      Yes. The fourth picture was just an example of the choices I have available for vegetative plants. There's no shortage of new materials. When I say cull, I just mean thin the herd. I think my post title is misleading. It sounds like I was just about to say F everything and quit completely, and that is NOT the case.

      I'm not going to do anything rash at this time. If anything I might do a partial cull, but definitely not everything. Getting some second opinions for now. Thanks for weighing in.

    #4
    Originally posted by SoOrbudgal View Post
    Are you going to get another light? Are those true watts from the wall?
    The two Viparspectra XS-1500's are newly added last week. I am considering getting 2 more, or a single 200 watt. I'm not sure how they stack up against the P-1500 or SF lights at the same wattages, but they appear superior to the BloomPlus 150 watt LEDs that were given to me (brightness and color temp-wise).

    I agree, having quality lights from the get-go is important. Lesson learned.

    As for wattages, yes, 150 wall watts per lamp according to manufacturer. Obviously the overall efficiency varies based on driver quality and LED type. The Viparspectra lights use 301B, the others, who knows. I haven't measured the wattages with a meter.

    Comment


      #5
      The age of the LED is important too, they do loose efficiency as they are used over the years.
      I myself like variety, something you cant get from cloning, and seeds are not that expensive. I have done clones, but give them away.

      Comment


        #6
        I like the VS XS1500 Pro model. The regular 1500 is also good but I'm very impressed with the Pro model I have hanging in the 2 x 2. For price to performance I don't see another 2 x 2 light beating it. My only complaint is the step dimmer. I like sweep dimmers to fine tune the light output.

        Stay the course. As others have said. The plants you currently have flowering showed you what vegging a cannabis plant is like. Now let it teach you what caring for a flowering cannabis plant is like. You already know how to clone/propogate so the ones you have vegging now will teach you how to time your propogation. Use them to time your clones to the flowering plants you currently have. You could take clones off the clones you have veggjng now that will be outsized by the time your current plants are ready to harvest. Knowing how to propogate gives you the advanage of being able to make as many plants as you want when you want.

        I can usually get a nice set of roots going within a 14 day window but I setup a 21 day window to transplant them to make sure they're well rooted.

        Comment


          #7
          Originally posted by Rootsruler View Post
          You already know how to clone/propogate so the ones you have vegging now will teach you how to time your propogation. Use them to time your clones to the flowering plants you currently have.
          This is a summary of my thoughts yesterday after thinking about it all day and reading the comments here. Propagation is the thing I have a small degree of confidence in. I just need to fine tune the timing of cuttings.

          As for flowering, you're right. I need to learn. I'm probably going to need some feeding advice soon. I'm unsure how much more PK I should be giving now that we're going into week 4. Plants don't look hungry to me but I don't know how to read them like veg plants yet.

          Comment


            #8
            Originally posted by Rwise View Post
            I have done clones, but give them away.
            I wish I had someone to donate plants to. I don't think the local dispensaries would appreciate it if I dropped a giant cardboard box of orphans on their doorstep, but somebody might love that situation.

            Comment


            • Rootsruler
              Rootsruler commented
              Editing a comment
              I like to fuck with my neighbors and do some midnight gardening in their flowerbeds after I've culled the losers.

            • DW2
              DW2 commented
              Editing a comment
              Rootsruler, cold, cold, cold! Remind me to never mess with You! LOL!

            • Rootsruler
              Rootsruler commented
              Editing a comment
              DW2 - Most of them catch it fairly quickly and, I assume, they dig it up and toss it although....one of my neighbors a block away from me mentioned her plant one day when I was walking by her place. Whenever she's outside and I'm walking by I'll stop and chat with her about her garden. She knows I smoke but she doesn't know I cultivate so she pulled me in once and whispered that she had a marijuana plant growing in her backyard that she found growing in her flowerbed! LOL!

              I asked her if she knew who planted it and she said she didn't know so I'm wondering if I'm not single handedly starting up new growers by accident!!! LOL!

            #9
            Keep doing what you're doing currently as far as propogation but, once you're confident you've mastered it your way, look into a DIY aerocloner.

            DIY 5 Gallon Bucket Aeroponic Cloner (youtube.com)​

            Comment


            • 12HourPower
              12HourPower commented
              Editing a comment
              Definitely, I have thought about it. Seems appropriate for an intermediate/advanced experience propagator. I'm glad I got the fundamentals down first. I doubt I have mastered it yet but it feels like I know what I am doing, more or less. I have some particular questions about scoring but haven't searched the forum yet. There doesn't seem to be a consensus on the technique.
              Last edited by 12HourPower; 02-03-2024, 03:36 PM. Reason: Added mo'

            #10
            Originally posted by Rootsruler View Post
            I have a couple submersible nebulizers that create almost the same fountain effect as the pump he uses. Makes a splash about 6-8 inches above the water surface, little drops jumping up. And thick, thick fog. He mentioned a mist head, I wonder if the neb would work even better?
            Last edited by 12HourPower; 02-03-2024, 03:51 PM. Reason: Typo

            Comment


            • Rootsruler
              Rootsruler commented
              Editing a comment
              Only one way to find out!!!

            #11
            Update: we're carrying on. Far from perfect, but it's a grow. Day 30.

            Click image for larger version

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            Struggled with DH refusing to trigger until 55-60% on its own, even set at 35% I'm basically running it non-stop and triggering the humidifier at 40%. This seems crazy to me. But it's working.

            Thanks again to everyone. Going back to lurking now. More photos in a few weeks.

            Comment


            • Ckbrew
              Ckbrew commented
              Editing a comment
              Carry on...

            #12
            I would reccomend a light meter. Might cut back on stretching. Top em next time. Keep going. You got this far and they look healthy might as well see what happens.

            Comment

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