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    SOIL Spoiled organics

    Hello all,

    First post.


    Living in one of the most backward thinking States in the US, sometimes I feel we are forgotten when I read articles and issues
    that affect areas with more liberal MJ norms and laws.

    Here’s an example:

    I have been tweaking the same 6 plant, soil setup for 12+ years now. I have evolved through the usual grow light technologies and now use 2-315 CMH lights in a 17.5 sf grow space. I have used multiple organic nutrient lines but now seriously considering changing to a full synthetic nutrient grow. I have resisted the thought of using “chemicals” and would prefer to stick with organic nutrients.

    My concern is that by the time organic nutes and bagged medias reach my area, they may not be as safe and effective as they once were. For years I went to some trouble and expense to buy Fox Farms Ocean Forest media locally. Over time I began noticing inconsistent results with consistent symptoms.

    My belief is that by the time the organic products reach me they may have “spoiled”. I have called FF on multiple occasions to ask for their lot numbering syntax in an effort to determine a manufacturing date. They would only give me the manufacture date when I supplied them with their specific lot number.

    Now I buy my grow media from a local nursery that sells a custom blend that is handled and stored with care. Sure, I have had some minor issues but the sporadic problem-grow appears to be a thing of the past. I’m sure that poorly handled organics isn’t unique to my area but I haven’t seen the issue of long distances, poor handling and low turn over addressed before.

    So, I would very much appreciate your thoughts on “spoiled” organics vs synthetic nutrients.

    Peace,
    Last edited by jcapesius; 11-24-2019, 05:14 PM.

    #2
    This is my main reason for using synthetics. I have had no issues with synthetics but have thought of trying organics, but like you said, in a non legal state having things shipped is a gamble on shelf life. I'm interested in what others say as well. I use the GH flora trio series and have used it for years with no issues, but wanted to see if there was a difference with organic gardening. Subbed to see what others have to say!

    Comment


      #3
      Are you guys using dry amendments for your soil or liquid fertilizer? If it’s liquid forget about it might as well be using synthetic nutrients and that’s just my opinion. Try a true living soil that way you guys order once and reuse your soil media for years. I buy my dry amendments ( nutrients/minerals) from buildasoil.com or KIS organics.com (compare prices)then I buy my sphagnum peat moss from Lowe’s and lava rock for aeration from same place or if you have a rock supply store most likely they have it cheaper that’s where I found mine. Then mix that together there’s your soil mix. Next I have comfrey growing outside also aloe Vera. Those alone are very useful the aloe to water my plants and the comfrey to top dress on soil. There is more to this but it’s very simple. Feel free to ask questions if I can answer them I will no problem. as far a bottled nutrients they are just selling you water and are not transparent at all someone posted here that miracle grow bought off gh trio and miracle grow is partners with Monsanto I think is what the post said so that alone scared me away back when I was using GHTrio because Monsanto may not have his hands directly in the pot but miracle grow does and I wouldn’t trust anyone sleeping with the enemy. I mean go ask miracle grow anything about Monsanto I doubt they’ll have anything bad to say about them, I mean would you talk shit about your business partner? I wouldn’t and it’s not like they didn’t know what Monsanto is about. Plus all the plastic bottles that are being wasted and all the runoff going into our water systems it’s ridiculous. The last time I used bottled chemicals I made the mistake of throwing them all down the same drain big mistake the mixed and made a horrible smell I couldn’t get rid of it my entire house smelled like rotten eggs coming out of my sink. Only thing that got rid of the smell was some lacto basillus I had made myself after learning about living soil and and how to diy all I need to grow my own bomb shit.

      Comment


        #4
        Spoiled? I'm a simple country boy. When I think of organic materials and gardens I think more of decomposition which leads to a material that can be absorbed into roots. If your growing medium is over saturated you may experience some stink from organic material, or the day you fertilize you may smell it, and that puts off the alarms to your nose you have spoilage, but the plant probably disagrees. I have had fish emulsions turn extremely nasty smelling, which is why I only use them in mixes that are to be used right away, but even that was probably not spoiled for plant consumption. I wouldn't drink it 🤢 plant seems to think it's great. Smell after a few days is horrible.
        Lighting systems:
        600 W HID/HPS
        450 Viparspectra
        4 ft T8 bulb X6

        Grow medium:
        Coco/perlite/soil mix

        Nutrients:
        Calmag, Alaska 5.1.1, Foxfarms Growbig, Foxfarms big bloom, Foxfarms Tiger bloom, Granny's unsulfured molasses

        Comment


          #5
          As far as synthetics, during my college years I had to debate organic vs synthetic. My stand was pro organic, my reasoning was simple and argument even simpler. Asians make a simple flavor enhancing sauce by breaking down fish and salt into a basic monosodium glutamate. This is ancient technology for them yet their society shows zero effects from it. Americans absorb the same but synthetic in almost all processed foods and it is definitely proven to be harmful. Even though the basic chemicals to create both organic and synthetic versions are the same, synthetic is more concentrated, so using less is more important. Strictly my opinion, I hope it helps you decide. Less is more is always my mantra when it comes to nutes, unless the plants show they want more.
          Lighting systems:
          600 W HID/HPS
          450 Viparspectra
          4 ft T8 bulb X6

          Grow medium:
          Coco/perlite/soil mix

          Nutrients:
          Calmag, Alaska 5.1.1, Foxfarms Growbig, Foxfarms big bloom, Foxfarms Tiger bloom, Granny's unsulfured molasses

          Comment


            #6
            jcapesius i have a friend who lived in Homer Alaska. He had trouble with getting stuff shipped. I am not asking where you live but these days most backward thinking places , and I live in one of them, still get stuff shipped in a few days. Even my mother-in-law who still lives in an extremely rural US/ Canada border town, who has no cable or wi-fi can get over night shipping if necessary. This amazes me but maybe I’m spoiled enough to have a shitload of delivery options. I’m interested as well in the progression of your post. I too prefer organic gardening. Good luck!

            Comment


            • jcapesius
              jcapesius commented
              Editing a comment
              I may have been too vague on what I mean by spoiled organics, so please allow me to try again.

              I am always amazed at how fast I can have something seen on the interweb delivered to my door almost before I can even use it. When we receive organics, whether nutes or grow media, we have no idea it's history, at least for me locally. I am certain that when these items were first produced they were everything the manufacturer claimed they were. What you can't know is how it was stored or handled since first manufactured. This is where the spoiled organics can be created. I used to purchase FFOF soil from my local Ag store until I saw pallets of bagged soil sitting in a parking lot in mid August for over a month before there was room to move them inside and therefore, out of the elements. I can assure you from using that soil that my grow was terrible and only after repeated flushings did things marginally improve. After the fact, I went back and checked the pH of an unopened bag of soil and the average pH was 4.9pH. I can't imagine that it left WA at that pH. Please don't ask me to explain what happens when you let quality bags of soil soaked by rain and baked at high temps for weeks or even months.
              I just know that it isn't good! I will do my best to only purchase organics from sources that handle their products appropriately. BTW, I've been told by GWE that KIND soil claims to do just that.

            • Farmall
              Farmall commented
              Editing a comment
              Oh... I get it now....sorry

            #7
            We get our soil out of the woods, where we deer hunt in the Ms.Delta, very fertile and rich, every shovel full is loaded with red wigglers, and we got 2 old cast iron bath tubs, we keep it in, so it's really my mommas old worm beds, she used for bream fishing.
            When I fill up my pots ,I just use about 30-40percent perlite,
            I've used KindSoil a good bit, and it's good too, but from now on I'm just sticking with our soil.
            Really easy to make your own soil too,like mentioned above, and keep it alive.
            Good Luck
            Cfls for a week or two
            315lec for everything else
            Dug up Ms.topsoil, with perlite added
            36x36x63 inch tent.
            6inch - exaust - intake fans an scrubber
            Smart pots
            Molasses
            Autoflowers

            Comment

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