HELP! Trichomes

[Bigpapa]

I’m entering week 16 of the Northern Lights grow and I would like an opinion on the readiness of this plant for harvest. I’m thinking 🤔 another week before the flush.

[DrPhoton]

Thats a nice high quality image you have there, i was able to zoom right in. How long in flower has it been ? It does not look far away yet, no signs of any amber. Trichomes look cloudy but could possibly develop some more. Overall its a nice looking girl.

Using visual cues of trichomes for the most part works great, but as per previous discussion not all aspects are equal. Amber development is typically used as an indicator. But sometimes amber develops really late, so late infact that many people have reported the non existance of amber with particular strains. So you must also use other aspects such as flowering time and floral characteristics to calculate the best time to harvest.

[Bigpapa]

Tomorrow will be the end of week 8 of flower 🌺. In my previous 2 grows with this strain, going the same period of time, I had no amber trichomes at harvest mid-week of week 9 of flower.

[DrPhoton]

Northen lights is mostly indica which is likely why the recomended harvest window is between 7-9 weeks. Amber is really not sought after with indica based strains. That strain would likely develop amber around 10-12 weeks or even longer. A quick online search shows several people reporting that northen lights is difficult to present amber with. Based on your duration of flower, floral characteristics and trichome condition. I would put the ideal harvest at around end of week 9 or even mid week 10.

Hopefully others who have experience with northen lights will chime in

[alltatup]

DrPhoton Can you give me citations for your statement: "Amber is really not sought after with indica based strains."

I have read otherwise, and each day I realize just how much each one of us must depend on our own experiments to determine what is valid and what is internet legend about cannabis. So if you can please tell me where this information comes from?

[DrPhoton]

Here you go. The reason it is not ideal is because of the higher concentration of CBD in indica strains and its interaction with CBN when more amber is developed.

[kingfish]

I have the same thing right now with a Purple Kush. I'm heading into week 9 and have all milky trichomes but not a single amber. I've grown the same plants last season and by week 8 I harvested her. If no amber by Saturday, she is getting wacked.

[9fingerleafs]

i agree with you guys, not all the strains are the same, this 8 week flowering indica looked kinda "amber" the whole time

there are only clear and light amber.. but no cloudy, this green crack instead

all cloudy and no amber...

my conclusion is all trichomes degrade by oxidizing and turn amber eventualy thus converting THC into CBN...
but im sure depending on the cannabinoid ratio of each individual strain some are full with THC when ripe (all cloudy) and some other have lots of CBN and CBD (lots of amber) when ripe

[DrPhoton]

Whats interesting is that THC is not at its peak when cloudy but when its actually clear. I talk a little bit about that here.

As to why some develop amber later than others, i cannot exactly say. I could only guess the degradation of THC into CBN is just different in strains. CBD is not related to the amber effects and or is not a degradation. CBD and in fact all cannabinoids are manufactured in the trichome from precurser chemicals.

[MadMike]

@ninefingerleafs -- Amazing close up photos! Impressive.

DrPhoton -- read your post and it's helpful. Good to know ambers might not show up.

[D.A.A.S.69]

I grown an awful lot of plants, in my life, every one I've ever grown has had some amber in them. One out of a thousand might not show amber, but the other 999 will.

[Bigpapa]

The more I look the more cloudy trics I see. I took about 3 hi res macro shots of her buds and downloaded the to my Mac for closer inspection. The vast majority of the tric tops are cloudy. Check it out.

[Locrian99]

Those are some awesome pics man.

[DrPhoton]

I even see a few amber there too. I remember mentioning to you how different loupes can change the appearance and color of the trichomes. This is a good example, although the scope is unchanged. How its used can have an effect too. Unless it was taken from a different part of the plant which could also explain the differences.

Based on that anyway, it would appear pretty close. I probably wouldnt let it go any longer than another week, if that. Your in the golden zone. You could chop today if you wanted. Keep checking around to see if you can reproduce these in other parts of the plant.

[starramus]

Definitely the beginnings of amber. For my personal preference I would chop chop now.

[Bigpapa]

Typo alert! That was 30 not 3 pics 😬

[alltatup]

http://growhappyplants.com/look.html

I found thIs article to be very helpful on the correlation between strain and trichome color.

[starramus]

Bigpapa since you are growing an Indica is a sedating effect what you are looking for? My wife likes a good couch lock effect so I postponed harvest on some Blue God per her request. I didn't harvest until I had plenty of amber. I may have overdone it a bit. It kinda depends on what you are looking for.

[DrPhoton]

alltatup

Firstly thank you for providing this, although i disagree with the article as you will read. There was much viable information from the papers cited there. I am much grateful for that.

I believe the writer misinterpreted data from the papers he cited and did not completely or thoroughly read them. Although for a breif moment i thought the guy was on to something, but ended up confused by the end. Until i read the three cited articles and papers, all became clear.

The main points of his confusion i believe are in the difference between stored degradation and biosynthesis degradation (living plant). Although he makes some great points about the transition from clear to opaque which i was always wondering about.

He cites a paper done on stored cannabis and the indication of age by analyzing cannabis samples. These results provided a relationship profile of the concentration ratio between THC to CBN and storage time to provide approximate age of a STORED cannabis sample.

He used this to prove to himself, plus his questionable test results that THC does not significantly degrade and that the transition of THC to CBN was not a complete conversion. Or perhaps not even happening. Basically concluding that amber is not a negative quality. At least thats what i could conclude from his somewhat confusing writing.

However what he failed to understand was that the paper was about STORED cannabis and not biosynthetically active (living plant) cannabis. And also his interpretation of THC to CBN was wrong, there was a complete identifiable measurement from THC to CBN. This 'ratio' is what allows the method of aging to work in the first place. As the THC needs a reference in order to work. As the original THC level is unknown, CBN is used as the reference due to it being the converted chemical. Although some amount is not directly converted to CBN, this was merely pointed out as to adjust for error in the calculation. Thats it.

The other paper he cited was basically about the anatomy & physiology of THC in the trichome. Quite fascinating paper really. Bascially one part of the paper detailed the aging of trichomes and the relationship of its color to its cannabinoid profile. What they found was that as the trichome aged from mature to aged and then to senescence. There was a clear distinction between them with the cannabinoids.

This paper alone made clear points about the transition of age and color and its effects on cannabinoid levels. He further cites Mel. Frank who also cites papers saying very similar conclusions.

Here Mel Frank cites

"In marijuana, the more color that the gland heads developed, the less THC they contained, and in the case of hemp, the less CBD. In both cases, color indicated a loss of THC or CBD—and the deeper the color, the more serious the loss, since pure THC is transparent."

He continues talking about the conversion of THC to CBN

"Keep in mind that while THC and CBD are both produced by the plant, CBN is not; it is the oxidative degradation product of THC. In other words, THC exposed to oxygen (air) degrades to CBN and the higher the temperature, the faster the degradation."

And here he talks about the relationship of the color to THC degradation.

"In fact, the color change reflects the aging of the gland contents, and the color itself most likely comes from the polymerization of essential oils in the gland heads; these essential oils give marijuana varieties their distinctive fragrance and taste. The color change may indirectly indicate that THC is changing to CBN"



One thing that he does seem to be correct on is the transition of the trichome from clear to cloudy. Which he quotes as..

"Transparent resins, regardless of color, are a sign that the plant is actively carrying out resin biosynthesis. When biosynthesis ceases, resins turn opaque as cannabinoid and aromatic levels decline."

Basically what this means is that THC is highest when trichomes are clear and opaque is an indication of the decline in manufacturing of these cannabinoids. There is much more i dissected from the article but this is the most important from it.

Basically i would ignore what was written and understand these important points.

THC most definitely converts into CBN.

Color shifting has been shown as the degradation of cannabinoids, as pure THC is clear.

Color shifting appears to highlight the transition of THC to CBN in studies, as such using it as a indicator in maturity is possible.

Opaque or clowdy resin is a indication of the downregulation of cannabinoid manufacturing, particularly THC.

I will be using this information to rewrite my original article on trichomes which will be a while yet before its published. Much thanks again Alltatup.

[DrPhoton]

I dont know what you mean by that post, what i have previously said is backed up by mel frank and robert clarke. There is a stage where there can be cannabinoid biosynthesis and cananbinoid degradation, which can crossover from still developing levels of THC to degrading levels.

Here Robert Clarke describes it.

"Variations in the level of THC in the same trichome as it matures are the result of THC acid being broken down to CBN acid while CBD acid is being converted to THC acid. If the rate of THC biosynthesis exceeds the rate of THC breakdown, the THC level in the trichome rises; if the breakdown rate is faster than the rate of biosynthesis, the THC level drops."

Basically you can have degradation of THC (amber) while still having rising levels of THC.

If your willing to know more let me know, i thought i might have sensed a bit of hostility in your writing. If not i apologize.

[alltatup]

No Dan, no hostility meant whatsoever!! I based that comment on what I read about the sat. dom. strains that never go milky, only turn amber and darker--until of course the stage where they're like a rotting apple and they are all brown.

[DrPhoton]

Ok thats good,

Yes i remember reading about the particular strains that do not go cloudy, but these are rare. Indicating they are high THC producers because their biosynthesis continues well into and past maturation. Like i have said before, the clear to cloudy is a seperate process from the color shift process. But i could understand the confusion. Just remember, even though THC degradation occurs, does not mean THC is still not developing. When resin goes from clear to cloudy or opaque, this indicates the deceleration of THC production. Not the overall level of THC.

Most strains i know however do go opaque or cloudy before oxidation of THC occurs, but as said some do proceed past

[starramus]

So apparently from this we all have been harvesting not at the peak THC, but after it has begun to degrade. My next grow I am going to set aside one plant to harvest from beginning with clear trichomes taking samples towards amber dating each sample. I need to know.

[DrPhoton]

Sounds good, perhaps try green crack out. Its got a speedy, energetic high too.

[alltatup]

Starramus, I have been in the habit of harvesting when many triches are still clear and bulging. Plain and simple: this is when THC is at its peak quantity.

[Locrian99]

Have to agree with danger dan on the green crack, it’s a go to