Double chromosome, anyone doing or done it?

[Rwise]

I did this years ago, but lost the strain to a thief (he got my seed patch), now it is legal for me to grow my own and I would like to pick this back up. But, I dont remember the recipe, and have had no luck with google, except to find colchicine is what I need, IIRC, the recipe came from a book I dont remember the name of. I extracted the colchicine from a flower bulb that was locally available.
Any thoughts or tips, links I have not yet found would be wonderful! Lots of stuff out there on genetics, lots!
Thanx for any info!

And the best comment I got on this strain was "If thats your home grown, I dont want any, I want to be able to walk out of here",, Kewl, I'll smoke it myself!

Edit; anyone have a copy of the 1974 cannabis alchemy? It may have been in it.
Edit 2, not in that book, I found the text version,,,

[9fingerleafs]

I don’t understand what you talking about but I’m interested what are you trying to do?

[Rwise]

Doubling the chromosome count in the plant, increasing strength or amount of THC. I last did this about 30 years ago, and have smoked some good bud since,, they say it makes you forget,,, plants would be polyploid after doing this.

Edit,, I like making my own strains, takes years to get them stable, but I still have time.

[9fingerleafs]

Oohhh I see, never heard of that before, I’m gonna do some reading on that, fascinating stuff. Please share any experiments you do

[Rwise]

Here is some good info

https://www.dudegrows.com/creating-polyploid-plants/

[Rwise]

I found this on 420 mag

https://www.420magazine.com/community/threads/post-your-polyploids.345286/

It was worth a look just for the pics and memories of what these plants can look like!

Copy and paste from 420 mag
Colchicine treatment is done in one of the following ways:

a. Seed treatment:

The dry or soaked seeds are soaked in aqueous solution of colchicine of different strength in shallow container to facilitate aeration (generally, aqueous solutions of 0.25 to 0.5 per cent concentrations are used). Colchicine treatment is given for a definite period which is different for different seeds.

After the seeds are soaked in colchicine solution for desired period, they are washed thoroughly in water and then they are sown. Treatment of dry seeds gives better result than soaked seeds in some cases.

b. Seedling treatment:

Seedlings may be treated in young stage. During treatment, the shoot tips are dipped in 0.2% colchicine solution and root tips are covered with cotton soaked in water and the treatment may be given from 3 to 24 hours and in some cases the treatment should be repeated on 2nd and 3rd day also.

c. Treatment of growing buds of shoot:

In some cases growing points are treated with 0.1 to 0.5% solution of colchicine which is applied by brush or with a dropper. Sometimes cotton wool soaked in the aqueous solution of colchicine is applied over the growing point of plant.

The treatment is repeated once or twice daily for a few days. Alternatively, 0.2 to 0.5% colchicine solution is mixed with lanoline paste and is smeared on the shoot apex. This treatment may be repeated 2-3 times daily for a week.

d. In woody plants, 1.0% colchicine solution may be applied over the growing bud. For proper penetration of colchicine, the solution is applied 2-3 times a day for a week.

At any given time only a small proportion of cells would be in mitotic phase, hence repeated treatment should be given at brief intervals so as to double the chromosome number in good number of cells. There may be a competition between polyploid cells and unaffected diploid cells and some-times diploid cells may compete over the polyploid cells and diploid shoots may arise from the treated growing apex.

Effect of Colchicine:

When colchicine is applied some irregularities occur in the mitotic division. It has no effect on doubling of chromosomes which proceeds in normal fashion. This chemical is a spindle poison and it simply checks the anaphasic movement of chromosomes to the two poles and consequently mitosis fails to complete.

The doubled chromosomes become bounded by a nuclear membrane, thus a restitution nucleus with double chromosome number is formed.

[9fingerleafs]

Thank you very much for sharing this

[Rwise]

I will be obtaining the flowers to make this from, and do some once again.
Always glad to share!

[Farmall]

I have a book from 1975 on growing that I found after 42yrs in my closet under some camera stuff. There is a whole section devoted to colchicine. Be happy to post it if it is permitted? Dangerous shit however if I remember what the book describes. Just thinking. It’s not permitted due to copyright violation

i guess I could name the book and the author?

[9fingerleafs]

I think you should share it if you want to, there’s no copyright police around here 😉

[Farmall]

Haha.... will do it when I get home...😅

[WeirdWiredWolf]

Yeah, colchicine can be dangerous, it is a drug after all and has the potential to interact badly with many other drugs (in addition to just being dangerous if you don't have the condition it's intended to treat).

https://www.drugs.com/mtm/colchicine.html

[Rwise]

They do say not to smoke the first generation,,,

[Farmall]

Well I began to wonder how you’d get this colchicine and found it online at several places....60 tablets about $40.00 +/-. Notwithstanding any guarantee, lab grade or purity

FInding this book after all these years reminded me that I must have always wanted to grow. The title is: Cultivators Handbook of Marijuana by Bill Drake printed in 1970. The chapter is called “ how to grow supergrass”. It clearly states : ONLY SECOND AND SUBSEQUENT GENERATION PLANTS ARE SAFE TO USE. There are quite a few pages to run thru. I am wondering if there is a way to attach a pdf and let those wishing to read up on it, read that part. It also states: BOLD AND UNDERLINED.....” colchicine is a highly poisonous substance. It can kill you. No research is available on the effects of smoking or ingesting first generation cannabis which has become polyploid through colchicine treatment. It is not known whether colchicine is metabolized or not. So only successive generations of cannabis—-generations number two on out—should be considered safe.”

It goes on to say don’t let in contact skin and you’ll need a prescription or a biology lab to acquire it.

So that is a chapter I’m thinking I can do without

[Farmall]

Can do... I just have to learn how to do that... as I was looking on google, I found that this book is listed on Amazon.... it has a price tag from 1975 of $3.00 on mine

[LordD]

I found it in amazon for $40, well, I don't know how to explain google drive(I barely use it) but aparentry you can upload PDF in this forum

[Rwise]

When I last did this, I used the extract from a flower, and we did try the first gen, not much or any noticeable change, and we did not get sick,, I am in no way saying it was safe! The noticeable change came the next year from the seed they made. I seen many mutations, and they grew extremely fast and potent!

[Rwise]

I have to wonder IF some of the seed banks/breeders have done this, I did find that Buddha seeds is experimenting with it.
I would have thought some here have done this!

[Farmall]

If there is a way to upload a pdf, I get it done. I will scan these today at work and have the files ready so that as we figure it out, it will get done. Holiday weeks ahead will interfere a touch but, not much

[Vitaminthc]

Aaaah someone is interested in this lol

PLEASE DO NOT GENETICALLY MODIFY YOUR WEED, WE HAVE ENOUGH SHIT ON THIS EARTH lol

But seriously unless you are a breeder looking to meet serious production demands it seems kinda pointless to me, colchicine can be made at home from the flower by crushing it together with seeds and really is it scarier than datura and scopolamine? I don’t think so, there’s many things that humans take to treat serious conditions like gout that can potentially kill you at high doses...

Colchicine produces a polyploid, that produces seeds that’s a tetraploid (4 sets chromosomes) you breed that with a diploid (two sets standard) and you get a Triploid (three sets)

You end up with a plant that’s a donkey, slow growth, larger node spacing, larger over-all plant structure, later calyxes and plant matter and some people say you get more crystals and resin but their just larger in physical size for some reason like a mutation lol.. but you cannot breed these plants, the clones are weak and genetically degrade quick.

IM SORRY TO BREAK IT TO YA’ll growers out there dreaming for the strongest crop from any plant and some chemicals, it does not affect thc levels.. there’s a reason the strongest strains in the world winning competitions and breaking records are from seed and are diploids!!

Cannabinoid levels in the plant have increased rapidly in the last 40 years due to the transition of cannabis growing naturally outside to being trained, stressed and it’s environments forcefully modified to squeeze the most from the plants which inbeds in the code and gets passed to off spring.

[D.A.A.S.69]

You are exactly tight about some of the Meds for Gout can kill yoi.
I just found this out in the last 2months, myself, it almost got me.
My old Dr, the Quack had me on Indomethacin and Colchicine for over a year, for inflammation of my left thumb, that he called Gout, I couldn't even grip a golf club anymore, and my thumb joint swoll up the size of a golfball too, over that year too. Those Meds, also helped in giving me Nutrient Lockout, from my food too, causing weight loss,
Luckily we found a new excellent Dr, that told me to quit taking that poison together, like I was doing, but i quit taking both of them, and now my thumb is back to normal size and does not even hurt anymore, plus I can grip a golf club again, and I'm also eating like a hog now too, even gaining my weight back that I had lost, not all of it back yet, but it's coming back, but that stuff, had us scared for awhile, .
But that ain't my only problems though, the other problem is smoking Jane too much, but i ain't worried about that problem.
You are right on the money about some Gout medicine, being very harmful, thanks for that

[9fingerleafs]

It’s pretty simple, we humans have been genetically modifying plants for our benefit since the dawn of agriculture, the same way that for generations farmers picked the biggest most flavorful tomatoes (unnatural selection) growers simple choose the higher thc to keep breeding, GMO’s are not all bad, it’s not the same using unnatural selection and hybridization than what monstanto does with DNA sequencers and tools like crispr. Just wanna clear the air about this, science is a tool we use to understand and take advantage of our world, science is not good or bad, and farmers are the original GMOers

[Rwise]

I have naked ladies (bulbs) and they contain Colchicine, not what I used last time, but good enuf. Now for what seed and when to do it,,,