LED COB vrs CFL

[DirtyNerd]

Hi all,

I haven't asked a question here in a while, I'm usually on the other end, answering something to the best of my knowledge. A little bit about me. I've been growing for years, and used all types of lights, MH/HPS, LED, and for the last four years or so CFL' s. Although, less productive, I find the CFL bulb to suit my needs adequately. I never grow more than one plant at a time and for this reason, and it's obvious, I don't really need an HID setup as the cost of hydro outweighs my end results/yield. I can easily get six ounces of dried flower using my CFL setup, utilizing a high yielding compact strain. I can't emphasize enough about quality genetics. My setup is simple, it consists of twelve CFL bulbs, six 6500 k and six 2700, flower and vegetative, so just under 300 watts of actual power. In all honesty I've changed my bulbs out for flowering and vegetative, with very little difference in final yield. I used to do 6500 k for vegetative, than switch to 2700 k for flowering. Now, I keep it simple and mix equal amounts of both for the entire grow. I cultivate more Automatics than Photos. The mix seems relevant to me perhaps because most lights now a days are full spectrum, I don't know. However, that my current setup. It works fantastic. The grow box is beautifully setup, lots of bulb extenders, an inline fan/carbon filter setup, you know the drill.

Okay, now to the nuts and bolts to my fellow growers. I want to invest in COB style LEDs rather than purchasing let's say for the sake of the lack of better words, dirty CFLs. The bulbs I was looking at were practically the same size as the CFLs, if not smaller. They come in 6500 k and 2700 k. A first time investment would see me pay a slightly higher cost, however they last triple to four times as long, generate far less heat, no heat up time and no significant loss of life span when turning on or off. In essence, I will end up saving in the long run. The LEDs in question have, I think like 70 plus diodes per bulb, with an equivalency of 120 watt, and are of course E27s, and are very similar shape to my CFLs.

So, does the light color differ from 6500 k LEDs to 6500 k CFLs and the same for 2700 k? I've done some research, unbiased opinion say no, in fact the LEDs are far more efficient in every way shape or form, even when it comes down to final yield/plant growth. Before I invest in these bulbs, I want you, the GWE group to way in on this above mentioned topic. Any and all are welcome, maybe some of you already use these bulbs??? I need your input. Will these perform the same as CFLs, does a plant interpret these two very different bulbs in the same way???

And please, before you try and persuade me to use HID or high intensity LED, I own them all. Many different types. Again, I'm using just what "I" need. This setup of mine is incredibly efficient. I adore it. So the real question is about the bulbs themselves, LED and CFLs. I just have gotten sick of replacing my CLFs. And, yes I recycle them. I'm just trying to simplify my grow, my life has gotten far too busy, so I need some long lasting, less maintenance type of bulb. Sorry for being long winded, however I value your opinions. In short, I want a safe environment, I'm just not a big fan of very hot light bulbs.

Sincerely,

D.N.

[Bigpapa]

You need to read DangerDan’s article on
lights. Covers this topic completely.

[DingusKhan]

That is a fantastic article. I've had a Roleadro 400watt COB unit that cost about $90, still runs great. If you want to build your own, check out Growmaus on youtube. Or, alternatively, these LED flood lights are cheep and far better than spiral CFLs.

[DirtyNerd]

Hey guy's,

Thanks for the input. I've been deliberating this idea for a while. Where would I find Danger Dan's article, I'm guessing on this site??? The main reason I ask such a question is, I've put so much effort in my box. It's a little gem. Over the last few years I've kind of mastered the art of plant training, mostly due to this site. I mean, I really could buy a tent, however, I think realistically, switching to more efficient bulbs would be more practical. I've got a 430 CFM six inch inline fan hooked up to a 400 CFM virgin charcoal filter, variable speed. My box is only 2 x 2 feet by 4 feet. So this fan is always just barely on. I've grown the stinkiest of stinky, a Cheese Fondue from Canadian Seed Lab. Boy did she smell at lights out. Thirty minutes into fire up, no more stink. Overkill, I know, effective, extremely.

It really does beg the question, and yes Dingus, it is a great topic, one that sure needs discussion. See, I know, by far CFLs really through a great color spectrum, almost the best, but as far as intensity is concerned, fairly poor in penetration. My bulbs are no further than a few inches away from plant material. So, do these COB LEDs in bulb form compete???, that's what I want to find out. I'm not worried about stealth, I own my own house. It's in my basement, it's a permanent fixture. Outdoor is not my cup of tea. I have a huge yard, however thieves abound. I don't know how they find plants but they do. Personally ,I've never been ripped off, but my neighbors have, and the neighborhood is certainly not the shadiest.

As stated in my prior post, I'm fairly busy, so the lower the maintenance and the safer, the better. Thanks again, for your remarks. And please share anymore information that's relevant to this thread!

Sincerely,

D.N.

[DrPhoton]

Light spectrums or spectrum quality has been shown to be of less importance than light quantity to plants. Saying that, different light technologies produce different efficiency characteristics with different wavelengths of light. So the color temperature can have an effect on electrical efficiency. For example green LED or LEDs with more affinity with green in their spectrum, is less efficient than blue or red. This IS the main reason why manufacturers are pushing the blurple (blue and red) spectrums. Not because plants do not use green, because they do. In fact green is used more efficiently than RED and BLUE at high irradiance.

Fluorescent has an efficiency of about 0.8umol per watt, with compact fluorescents being a little less than this because of their spiral design. The bulb dinguskhan suggests has an efficiency of about 1.2umol per watt which would be a fine replacement for fluorescent. However you may have to increase your proximity due to the nature of optics of LED fixtures, which tend to concentrate light a lot more.

Take a look at my articles on light for some further information.

[Bigpapa]

In addition, here is my personal experience.

Started growing in a VERYsmall stealth box 24”w x 18”d x 48”h under a MarsHydro 300w LED. I grew Northern Lights with reasonable results. Decent buds but not very dense. Did a couple of grows this way until I felt that my knowledge and capabilities exceeded the capacity of my box. I moved into a 4x4x80 tent with all of the bells and whistles and moved to 600w HID MH/HPS. I went from about 4 ozs per-plant to 8.6 ozs. So I effectively doubled the output of the same strain. That being said, during the entire grow I struggled with temp control. That, coupled with the increased utility costs, have made me consider moving back to LED lighting. Also, after reading DangerDan’s article on lights I have decided to go back to COB/LED. I’m still not completely convinced that I can get the same output from my grows under LED that I have gotten under HID. That, and I’m not yet willing to break the bank on some high end LEDs. So what I’ve done is go with 2 Roleadro 400w COB LEDs. I have yet to completely make the move. I currently have 2 autos in flower that I’m going to finish off under HPS. I have a Critical seedling under the COB that I intend to do fully under the COB LED.

That is my journey to where I am today in regards to lighting.

Good luck with your journey. I’m sure you will make an educated decision if you base your decision on the facts that are available in DangerDan’s article. That individual provides the most complete technical information that I have found on this site.

Grow well. Be well!!

[DirtyNerd]

Hi Guy's,

Awesome responses. Some real food for thought now. I'm going to look over the material provided. Pretty cool guy's, pretty much right up my alley, let's add some science to this. This is what I'm talking about. It's really easy to say, well, let's just through a four hundred watt HID at it, and, being the group we are, I'm sure we'd get some good results. You know, a dash of luck, a good quality grow media, some great nutrition, and bang, large yield. Been there, done that. Now its time to put some science to it. Again, I can't emphasize how genetics play a huge factor in this, however, I've grown out some, "sub standard beans" that have produced amazing yields.

Now bear with me, I know I'm going off topic, my latest girl was a Nordic Jack by Norden Seeds. At about $5.00 a seed, you really can't go wrong with this strain. Very stable @ every level. Norden is best known for "cold weather" strains. My basement is cold, like 50 degrees in the winter at lights out. I've got a soil temperature probe, and it never broke 62 degrees with lights on. Three and a half months later, almost six ounces dried, well almost. I'll post some pictures when jarred. Anyway, this plant withstood every bit of cold you could through at it. And all this from a, I personally, wouldn't say sub standard seed, but many would. I was looking for "cold resistant".

She's a Northern Light x Jack Herer. Super strong, but in a good way, hardly any odor. So, therefore, not to loose anymore heat I didn't even use my inline fan, just my adjustable CPU fan I have behind the bulbs, so to disturb the air from the bulbs so my inline can expell it. Keeping things warmer, for the winter months. Just a little bit about my last grow, a little insight if you will. So in saying that, I'll do some more research you all offered. I guess, I'm looking at things from a hobbyists point of view, kind of like all of us. Pretty cool my friends. I miss this site. I've been off work this week with an inner ear infection, so, not to put this week to waste, I've been looking at some mods to my box, in between grows. My next gal is the Candida CD-1. At up to 25% CBD and not exceeding 1% THC, she should be interesting. Now, this ones at the other end of the $ spectrum, at $25.00 a fem. seed. I'm a seed hoarder, or, my wife thinks so, just her opinion not mine.Thanks again all, keep the information and thread rolling.

Sincerely,

D.N.

[DingusKhan]

I really dig what you're trying to do, keeping it small and fun. I did recently step up a notch and get a CMH 315, but i still like having side grows going, outside the tent.

I think if you get one of those floodlights on your next stop at home dopey for about $10, you will be very surprised what one of those will do to an auto. Just one grew a bigger plant where iused to use 4 CFLs. I quit using CFLs altogether.

The plants love the 3000k, whatever that means.

[DirtyNerd]

Hey DK,

Thanks for the kind word's. Yeah, I've been trying for some time, you know, keeping it real. I really do things for myself, as I'm sure the rest of us do. Breaking things down to the get at the science of things. DangerDan is quite the master of all lighting, and I say that in all honesty. I've done a lot of horticultural courses at the College level as a past time, over the last decade, however, we never even came close to touching on lighting systems, rather, focusing more on plant morphology, ornamentals, soil structure, environmental impacts, nutritional intake and the like. DangerDan takes this to a whole new level, when it comes to how light is interpreted by plants. Holy cow. If you're tuned in DangerDan, kudos to you, consider yourself quite educated/extraordinary and I am humbled by your words. I enjoy every last thing about the cultivation of our coveted herb. It has always astounded me that all this genetic information can be purchased online, in seed form, shipped by courier and cultivated to an exact duplicate of its parental lineage. Now that's evolution. Put that in your pipe Mr Darwin.

How a plant could become such a wide spread specimen, so studied and loved by so many, is in fact natural selection. No matter what anyone says, bar none. How they managed to spread into our basements, where sunlight never existed, is quite the phenomenon. Unbelievable, is another more subtle way to say it. How could this be??? Some seeds are carried by way of the wind, oceans, in the stomachs of wildlife, not this one, it prefers to travel first class! Crazy isn't it???

Sincerely,

D.N.

[DrPhoton]

Thanks D.N, much appreciated. I have a lot of fun doing it, most of the time anyway ^.^

[DirtyNerd]

Hi Dan,

keep it up, you certainly are one in a million. Fundamentals are one thing, your a couple of steps away from a master's!

God bless you my friend,

D.N.