My first coir grow update

[Spanky]

I hoping to show you guys how much you helped me on my January 25 post. But I am not sure I am home free. Remember all the awful yellow leaves on the bottom? You mostly said water, water, water. I did. And, feed too. I did but I got small brown tips even on my newest growth. I was at half strength, so I cut that in half again and will pay attention to the response. I am also worried about the light spots on some of the leaves. You may need to zoom in. I left in the two blurry pics in case that helps you identify the problem more easily. This is plant number 1.

[Spanky]

Plant number two has always been slow to progress. I could even tell the seed wasn't as robust. But, you gotta grow what you have, right? This is plant two. Not as many spots as on plant one.

[Spanky]

So, should I worried about the spots or anything else? The spots don't seem to be progressing to more leaves, yet. Thanks!

[Deadhead91]

Looks like some kind of defiency can't say for sure or could be bugs, what nutes do you use? Ph levels going In and going out and what's your feed schedule? Also how far away is the light?

[Spanky]

Botanicare progrow, cal mag. Water, water, nute and calmag water, repeat. CFLs are as close as I can get them without burn, led is 19 inches. I think it might be pH fluctuation. Although I have been trying to get as close to 6.0 going in and out. Plant two, without spots, has had some fluctuation. A couple of waterings ago it was 7,0 coming out. I am trying to get that resolved. Plant one, with spots, is usually more consistent with 6.5 run off. No bugs that I can spot. Backs of leaves look clean.

[DrJohnCanna]

The plant looks weak, especially for its size. Maybe your PH has been out causing the leaves etc to look lifeless. A happy plant will always have its leaves beaming towards the light. The spots look like a big problem, a bug has been sucking on the leaves. Mine had this problem when I left it outside. Your attempt to LST is good, but the internal spacing is so close. Did you leave this plant in a small pot for most of its begginning?

[Deadhead91]

Ok so it most likely the ph and nitrogen deficiency. Personally I think you need a better nute setup, I use fox farm trio with sensi cal-mag xtra and bush doctor microbe brew. I really reccomend researching a bunch of nutrients and get a feel of the difference of products. With that being said your in coco coir you need to treat it that way which means yes your in soil but it's a soilless medium so it's treated as hydropnics feeding schedule but don't water too often, make sure it gets pretty dry so your not drowning it, roots need oxygen too. Also it could be overwatering.

[PRIMO]

It appears your pots are folded over, how deep is your coco? Roots also need room to do the booga-loo, and what are you using to read pH?

[Spanky]

I made the bags too tall. I haven't measured the height, but I am guessing 12 or more inches. I know there is still plenty of room because I can feel where the root ball is when I press on the bag. I am using pH drops.

[DrJohnCanna]

Spanky do you use Ph Down and Ph Up in the same reservoir to get pH perfect?

[Spanky]

I have only had to use pH down. My well water is about 7.0 No reservoir...coir.

[Deadhead91]

http://www.growweedeasy.com/ph#soil-pH

you should be about 5.5 to 6.5,
I've read that marijuana plants in the wild thrive on acidic levels.

[Deadhead91]

How often and how much do you water?

[Spanky]

When I had the problems with the yellow leaves, everyone was telling me to water a lot. I had been letting it dry until it was easy to lift. Some said everyday. Some said every eight hours. Some said use the lift test. Some said coco should always be wet. The tutorial suggests the first knuckle test. So, I started watering every other day. It seemed to like that. Then I tried every day. It didn't seem to mind that either. Right now I am trying nute and cal mag. Next day no water. Then plain water to runoff. Next day repeat. I cut my last nutes in half last time...so now 1/4 of manufactures recommendation. I didn't see any burned tips so I will stick with that for a while and up it slowly, like 1/4 ml at a time. I am shooting for 6.0 going in. I give each one a half gallon of water and get between one to two cups run off. It never sits in runoff as I have risers.

[Deadhead91]

Watering honestly is different for each person it seems, it depends on the size of pot and how much soil you got in it and then weather plays a huge part in how often you water also high humidity you water less frequently cause it dries slower then when it's dry out. I feed 1.5gallon RO water weekly in a 5gallon geopot but towards the end of flowering I'm currently watering and then feed ever 4days 1.5gallon RO water and flush every 2 weeks. Mr.furley has the best advice ever thanks a million man

[Spanky]

These are the photos I posted around January 25. The ones at the top of this thread are from February 5. Except for the spots, they seem to my inexperience eyes to be much improved. Maybe?

[Deadhead91]

Doing much better then what it was but your not out the woods yet, can we get some more current pics, any problem areas and new growth?

[Spanky]

The ones at the top of this thread are from two days ago. Not much has changed yet. i will post some more in a few days so you can see what is happening.

I have a new one for you. I have been puttin 6.0 water into number two plant. The runoff was around 7 a few days ago. Today I went in a bit lower. I nearly had a heart attack when the first runoff water was at 8! Am I just a terrible grower? How can this be?

I tested the runoff again a few minutes later and it was around 5.7. Same plant. Why would the initial water be so high? If I had retested that 7 with later water, I expect I would have been around 6 or 6.5.

What in the world is going on? Everyone says to test earliest runoff.

[Deadhead91]

I've read to test the ph of the water going in after letting it sit, oxygen in the water can affect the ph I read, I'm not too experienced with ph yet I reccomend maybe trying just flushing it to get the ph under control. Ph affects everything. Sounds like you might just need to reset the ph

[Spanky]

So, I have been researching this coco and ph thing. What I have been told is everything going in, should be as close to 5.8 as you can get it.

One of of my sources was Botanicare itself. They have always been very helpful about answering my questions. I also asked about how often to feed and how often to water.

This is the best explanation I have heard about why ph changes in runoff water, and as I learned, you really are interested in the first runoff water as the ph reading at this point is telling you what your medium ph is. As your incoming water washes this out, it is normal for the reading to change later in the runoff to closer to the ph you just put in.

Here is what Botanicare had to say:

I would recommend just to adjust your PH of everything to 5.8 going in. Reading run off is a great way to make sure your plant is up-taking nutrients. As the plant uses specific nutrients your PH of your water will change. You have probably noticed that your waters PH will also change as you add the different nutrients prior to watering.

The difference you saw when watering with the two run off samples is explained by the plant up-taking what nutrients it needed. After it had up-taken the nutrients it will change the PH of the water. If it does not uptake any of the nutrients odds are the PH will stay the same or close to.

I recommend feeding every day if in coco. Many growers have different opinions on this as you stated. This is something you can certainly play around with as every grower has different techniques and what works best for you is what I would recommend. This also goes for the amount of water you are using and the frequency of watering you are trying to get in. Your environment will determine a lot of this as well as the size of pots and many other variables.

Just remember this is an experiment that you are in control of.

I do disagree with the last part! I have never felt in control!

[Deadhead91]

I keep my coco run off around 5.5 and going in 6.0 to 6.5 you just got to find that sweet spot that the plant likes the most. And ya it's very misleading how most ppl say feed at half but I think what's ment is start at half and work your way up so you don't shock it either and depending on plant stage, like week 1veg you would barely feed it compared to how much it may need at week 4veg)

[Deadhead91]

Also the ph varies from nutrient to nutrient try ph'ing after youve added all the nutrients to it, like I use a lot of fox farm and they are super acidic so I only ever have to ph up

[Deadhead91]

If you can find a feed schedule like this for your nutes but for your brand

[Spanky]

Yes, I have the chart. I mix my cal mag, then nutes into a gallon of water. Let sit for a bit. Then I test the ph. Since my well water is about 7, the acidity of the nutes always brings the ph down. I only have to add ph down when giving plain water. Time to go water and adjust the binds. My plants keep wanting to get loose and grow up right! Wonder what my ph runoff will be today!

[Deadhead91]

You should test the well water for ppm levels then

[St.buds]

Yes well water can have tons of extras in it

[Waltermelon]

With coco, water at LEAST once a day (I try for 2 times). You should also run nutes full strength in coco. The old "run half strength" is more of a soil thing. Your lady's need food my friend. Hit them with full strength nutes with a, feed, water/cal-mag, feed schedule. Once they bounce back then play with your feed schedule.

[Deadhead91]

If your going to reccomend that you should be way more descriptive like how much does he water, and when he shouldn't and it depends on pot size and how much soil and weather

[Waltermelon]

I would be more descriptive if he was running soil. But he's running coco. NEARLY impossible to over water with that media. You can run 10gal at a time through it 3-5 times a day and be ok.

[Waltermelon]

Also something that could help you cut costs (unless you're going for a really long veg) is that you can get away with a lot smaller pots. I typically veg for 6 weeks. I can finish those with no I'll affect in 1gal nursery pots (.67gal) but I'll most of the time throw them in 3 gal square pots. The roots have never wrapped on me. I found that to Max out a 3 gal pot I need at least a 3 month veg plus the 2 month flower time. Just a suggestion to help with cost. Coco isnt all that cheap. The tops of your pots also look very very dry.